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There are cases in which hypocrisy is far better than the alternatives. Legolas Send a noteboard - 12/05/2011 10:04:32 PM
I personally have nothing against a Church that says, "We're going to accept homosexual priests because we view the Bible as a flawed work written by humans and influenced by prejudices and bigotry, and we choose not to follow the injunctions of Leviticus with respect to homosexuality, and to ignore Paul's indignation in Romans and Jude's indignation in his book." That would be honest.

Instead, I see hypocrisy.

And this is certainly one of those. There are hundreds of millions of Christians, Muslims and believers of other religions in the world who absolutely refuse to consider that their holy texts might be at all flawed - but some of them are nevertheless willing to show tolerance for gay people, or for other groups of people who are somehow condemned in their holy texts. That's inconsistent at best and hypocritical at worst, yes, but so what? Surely it'd be better for the world if we had more of those people and fewer of the consistent, non-hypocritical ones who follow their holy texts on everything.
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Presbyterian Church (USA) passes Amendment 10-A. Dannymac - 11/05/2011 05:39:29 PM 1497 Views
*NM* Sareitha Sedai - 11/05/2011 06:10:26 PM 357 Views
I am happy to see this. *NM* Ghavrel - 11/05/2011 07:22:59 PM 391 Views
Homosexuals must die! Dark Knight - 11/05/2011 08:25:25 PM 1160 Views
I agree! This sort of behavior can NOT be excused!!! LadyLorraine - 11/05/2011 10:38:16 PM 816 Views
Yay!!. Amys - 11/05/2011 10:38:51 PM 1089 Views
Glad to hear it. *NM* Legolas - 11/05/2011 10:46:39 PM 442 Views
Well done. *NM* Camilla - 11/05/2011 11:07:22 PM 392 Views
What's the language? Did they at least TRY to give a doctrinal justification? Joel - 12/05/2011 02:10:46 AM 1072 Views
Thank you for that rousing argument against married priests. Ghavrel - 12/05/2011 03:36:51 AM 995 Views
Why ARE you letting women into the priesthood? Tom - 12/05/2011 04:16:50 AM 922 Views
Because Episcopalians don't listen to the Bible much. Ghavrel - 12/05/2011 05:47:03 AM 857 Views
That's just fine as far as I'm concerned Tom - 12/05/2011 02:23:44 PM 887 Views
Yes, I suppose a church could go that route. Ghavrel - 14/05/2011 07:38:02 AM 832 Views
I'm not attempting to impose a dichotomy on the Bible. Tom - 14/05/2011 03:25:30 PM 912 Views
I don't even know what following the Bible in its entirety means. Ghavrel - 14/05/2011 09:09:10 PM 1074 Views
As an exercise, I tried to think of how I would justify allowing homosexuals as clergy. Tom - 14/05/2011 04:19:43 PM 904 Views
Wow. Joel - 20/05/2011 10:15:21 AM 921 Views
Thanks (I'm actually OK with women priests though). Joel - 12/05/2011 07:09:11 AM 960 Views
It's more a question of interpretational standards. Tom - 12/05/2011 02:29:43 PM 845 Views
Agreed. Joel - 14/05/2011 01:17:45 AM 924 Views
There's ample precedent for female religious leaders, even within the bible. Joel - 12/05/2011 06:51:05 AM 1011 Views
Since when is Moses' society the be-all end all? Dannymac - 12/05/2011 07:12:41 PM 861 Views
Since never, which is why I referenced five other eras you completely ignored. Joel - 14/05/2011 01:11:30 AM 967 Views
They did so, via negativa. Dannymac - 12/05/2011 04:22:17 PM 1036 Views
Sorry for the delay, particularly since it looks like I'll be spending a fair amount of time here. Joel - 14/05/2011 12:31:33 AM 840 Views
Your church has a constitution?! Dragonsoul - 12/05/2011 03:36:41 AM 902 Views
My Church has a congress! *NM* Ghavrel - 12/05/2011 03:37:52 AM 431 Views
Haha no way! *NM* Dragonsoul - 12/05/2011 03:46:32 AM 392 Views
Well, we have one group of laity and one of bishops, so it is only mildy utter chaos. *NM* Ghavrel - 12/05/2011 05:51:09 AM 428 Views
We have a General Assembly and a Moderator. Dannymac - 12/05/2011 04:18:34 PM 1002 Views
I had no idea the US was based on that system. Dragonsoul - 12/05/2011 06:22:58 PM 843 Views
It is pretty common practice random thoughts - 12/05/2011 06:54:02 PM 877 Views
Oh I'm sure it is with newer churches. Dragonsoul - 12/05/2011 10:49:11 PM 935 Views
I'm happy to hear this, personally. I also wonder how you reconcile this with the Bible. Tom - 12/05/2011 04:11:31 AM 1077 Views
Every direct reference to homosexuality in the Bible is a reference to rape. Dannymac - 12/05/2011 04:12:43 PM 906 Views
Every single word that you wrote in your response is complete bullshit. Tom - 12/05/2011 05:50:07 PM 1041 Views
Knock off your eisegesis, try some exegesis Dannymac - 12/05/2011 07:02:45 PM 946 Views
I'm trying to figure out just what your "gifts" are, because I don't see any. Tom - 12/05/2011 07:30:39 PM 918 Views
There are cases in which hypocrisy is far better than the alternatives. Legolas - 12/05/2011 10:04:32 PM 996 Views
Hypocrisy is better than, say, setting gays on fire, yes. Tom - 12/05/2011 10:10:40 PM 971 Views
My statement is that, from a pragmatic point of view, hypocrisy shouldn't be discouraged too much. Legolas - 13/05/2011 10:05:39 PM 992 Views
I strongly and vehemently disagree with your position. Tom - 13/05/2011 10:21:10 PM 839 Views
Oh, is that how we're playing this, then? Dannymac - 13/05/2011 06:29:31 PM 927 Views
Re: Oh, is that how we're playing this, then? Jacob - 13/05/2011 07:02:35 PM 910 Views
I'm not playing. I'm pointing out some glaring errors on your part. Tom - 13/05/2011 07:25:08 PM 832 Views
Danny will correct me if I'm wrong, but... Legolas - 13/05/2011 09:55:14 PM 1025 Views
Danny persistently refuses to say that Tom - 13/05/2011 10:13:55 PM 960 Views
And with respect to your textual point, once again you're wrong Tom - 12/05/2011 07:44:10 PM 1050 Views
The Bible says what it says. The problem... people like to tell us just what else it's saying. Jacob - 13/05/2011 05:31:29 PM 897 Views
You're a fucking moron. *NM* Dan - 15/05/2011 11:11:08 PM 416 Views
You make a very important but too often overlooked point. Joel - 14/05/2011 01:54:40 AM 1033 Views
??? the bible was harsher on homosexulaity than on rape random thoughts - 12/05/2011 06:56:43 PM 889 Views
Read Judges. Dannymac - 12/05/2011 07:17:29 PM 895 Views
You don't reconcile... you pick the parts you like and adjust the rest to suit you. TaskmasterJack - 13/05/2011 09:33:54 PM 818 Views
And you add in some New Age music and a little ankh as well *NM* Tom - 14/05/2011 02:35:27 AM 402 Views
Another example... Bramhodoulos - 12/05/2011 09:19:52 AM 818 Views
That's what people said about churches opposing slavery. Dannymac - 12/05/2011 04:06:26 PM 882 Views
I rest my case *NM* Bramhodoulos - 12/05/2011 04:48:32 PM 385 Views
That is a false dichotomy and we both know it. Joel - 14/05/2011 02:07:19 AM 870 Views
If you claim to follow the entire Bible, then you are completely correct. Tom - 12/05/2011 06:04:38 PM 813 Views
On the contrary, this move will take some butts out of the seats. Dannymac - 12/05/2011 07:16:22 PM 872 Views
We both know that isn't the case Tom - 12/05/2011 07:55:41 PM 976 Views
Whatever your issue is, get over it. Dannymac - 13/05/2011 06:17:26 PM 828 Views
You'd be a lot more effective... Jacob - 13/05/2011 06:45:31 PM 946 Views
You haven't adequately expressed your theology Tom - 13/05/2011 07:28:54 PM 928 Views
Cool cool. I have a question on a semi-related note, about Protestant Gospels beetnemesis - 12/05/2011 05:33:49 PM 928 Views
No Protestant denomination has added so much as a word to the Bible Tom - 12/05/2011 05:58:16 PM 810 Views
So, everyone hates Judith, then? beetnemesis - 12/05/2011 06:40:11 PM 891 Views
The Catholics and Eastern Orthodox Churches accept Judith as part of Scripture. Tom - 12/05/2011 07:51:27 PM 834 Views
Does the Eastern Orthodox Church also segregate deuterocanonical works like Roman Catholicism does? Joel - 14/05/2011 02:19:03 AM 1149 Views
The Eastern Church bases everything on the Septuagint. Tom - 14/05/2011 02:34:41 AM 893 Views
That sounds appealing, and makes sense. Joel - 14/05/2011 02:44:56 AM 901 Views
Oh, I just enjoy calling Protestants "heretics" to remind them not everyone agrees with them. Tom - 14/05/2011 03:25:42 AM 849 Views
Oh, but they know that; in many cases, they exult in it. Joel - 14/05/2011 06:06:01 AM 848 Views
Re: Cool cool. I have a question on a semi-related note, about Protestant Gospels Isaac - 12/05/2011 08:52:48 PM 872 Views
The NIV is terrible. The NASB has the best translation I have found (of the NT, at least). Ghavrel - 12/05/2011 10:43:58 PM 1016 Views
I find this really weird, to be honest beetnemesis - 13/05/2011 05:48:28 AM 926 Views
Well, it wasn't just Athanasius. But yes, we are lucky in that respect. *NM* Ghavrel - 13/05/2011 06:32:48 AM 366 Views
Athanasius's list reflected the victory of Pauline Christianity Tom - 13/05/2011 02:52:53 PM 838 Views
There's a school of thought that says that's a strong vindication of Athanasius. Joel - 14/05/2011 02:37:49 AM 793 Views
Since I haven't gotten around to asking yet... Isaac - 13/05/2011 07:14:01 PM 837 Views
Re: Since I haven't gotten around to asking yet... Dannymac - 15/05/2011 03:18:23 PM 1253 Views
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