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There are cases in which hypocrisy is far better than the alternatives. Legolas Send a noteboard - 12/05/2011 10:04:32 PM
I personally have nothing against a Church that says, "We're going to accept homosexual priests because we view the Bible as a flawed work written by humans and influenced by prejudices and bigotry, and we choose not to follow the injunctions of Leviticus with respect to homosexuality, and to ignore Paul's indignation in Romans and Jude's indignation in his book." That would be honest.

Instead, I see hypocrisy.

And this is certainly one of those. There are hundreds of millions of Christians, Muslims and believers of other religions in the world who absolutely refuse to consider that their holy texts might be at all flawed - but some of them are nevertheless willing to show tolerance for gay people, or for other groups of people who are somehow condemned in their holy texts. That's inconsistent at best and hypocritical at worst, yes, but so what? Surely it'd be better for the world if we had more of those people and fewer of the consistent, non-hypocritical ones who follow their holy texts on everything.
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Presbyterian Church (USA) passes Amendment 10-A. Dannymac - 11/05/2011 05:39:29 PM 1502 Views
*NM* Sareitha Sedai - 11/05/2011 06:10:26 PM 364 Views
I am happy to see this. *NM* Ghavrel - 11/05/2011 07:22:59 PM 393 Views
Homosexuals must die! Dark Knight - 11/05/2011 08:25:25 PM 1167 Views
I agree! This sort of behavior can NOT be excused!!! LadyLorraine - 11/05/2011 10:38:16 PM 821 Views
Yay!!. Amys - 11/05/2011 10:38:51 PM 1097 Views
Glad to hear it. *NM* Legolas - 11/05/2011 10:46:39 PM 447 Views
Well done. *NM* Camilla - 11/05/2011 11:07:22 PM 394 Views
What's the language? Did they at least TRY to give a doctrinal justification? Joel - 12/05/2011 02:10:46 AM 1079 Views
Thank you for that rousing argument against married priests. Ghavrel - 12/05/2011 03:36:51 AM 1002 Views
Why ARE you letting women into the priesthood? Tom - 12/05/2011 04:16:50 AM 929 Views
Because Episcopalians don't listen to the Bible much. Ghavrel - 12/05/2011 05:47:03 AM 866 Views
That's just fine as far as I'm concerned Tom - 12/05/2011 02:23:44 PM 896 Views
Yes, I suppose a church could go that route. Ghavrel - 14/05/2011 07:38:02 AM 840 Views
I'm not attempting to impose a dichotomy on the Bible. Tom - 14/05/2011 03:25:30 PM 918 Views
I don't even know what following the Bible in its entirety means. Ghavrel - 14/05/2011 09:09:10 PM 1079 Views
As an exercise, I tried to think of how I would justify allowing homosexuals as clergy. Tom - 14/05/2011 04:19:43 PM 911 Views
Wow. Joel - 20/05/2011 10:15:21 AM 930 Views
Thanks (I'm actually OK with women priests though). Joel - 12/05/2011 07:09:11 AM 967 Views
It's more a question of interpretational standards. Tom - 12/05/2011 02:29:43 PM 853 Views
Agreed. Joel - 14/05/2011 01:17:45 AM 928 Views
There's ample precedent for female religious leaders, even within the bible. Joel - 12/05/2011 06:51:05 AM 1015 Views
Since when is Moses' society the be-all end all? Dannymac - 12/05/2011 07:12:41 PM 867 Views
Since never, which is why I referenced five other eras you completely ignored. Joel - 14/05/2011 01:11:30 AM 973 Views
They did so, via negativa. Dannymac - 12/05/2011 04:22:17 PM 1048 Views
Sorry for the delay, particularly since it looks like I'll be spending a fair amount of time here. Joel - 14/05/2011 12:31:33 AM 853 Views
Your church has a constitution?! Dragonsoul - 12/05/2011 03:36:41 AM 912 Views
My Church has a congress! *NM* Ghavrel - 12/05/2011 03:37:52 AM 433 Views
Haha no way! *NM* Dragonsoul - 12/05/2011 03:46:32 AM 396 Views
Well, we have one group of laity and one of bishops, so it is only mildy utter chaos. *NM* Ghavrel - 12/05/2011 05:51:09 AM 430 Views
We have a General Assembly and a Moderator. Dannymac - 12/05/2011 04:18:34 PM 1011 Views
I had no idea the US was based on that system. Dragonsoul - 12/05/2011 06:22:58 PM 850 Views
It is pretty common practice random thoughts - 12/05/2011 06:54:02 PM 882 Views
Oh I'm sure it is with newer churches. Dragonsoul - 12/05/2011 10:49:11 PM 948 Views
I'm happy to hear this, personally. I also wonder how you reconcile this with the Bible. Tom - 12/05/2011 04:11:31 AM 1081 Views
Every direct reference to homosexuality in the Bible is a reference to rape. Dannymac - 12/05/2011 04:12:43 PM 914 Views
Every single word that you wrote in your response is complete bullshit. Tom - 12/05/2011 05:50:07 PM 1048 Views
Knock off your eisegesis, try some exegesis Dannymac - 12/05/2011 07:02:45 PM 952 Views
I'm trying to figure out just what your "gifts" are, because I don't see any. Tom - 12/05/2011 07:30:39 PM 927 Views
There are cases in which hypocrisy is far better than the alternatives. Legolas - 12/05/2011 10:04:32 PM 1006 Views
Hypocrisy is better than, say, setting gays on fire, yes. Tom - 12/05/2011 10:10:40 PM 985 Views
My statement is that, from a pragmatic point of view, hypocrisy shouldn't be discouraged too much. Legolas - 13/05/2011 10:05:39 PM 997 Views
I strongly and vehemently disagree with your position. Tom - 13/05/2011 10:21:10 PM 844 Views
Oh, is that how we're playing this, then? Dannymac - 13/05/2011 06:29:31 PM 935 Views
Re: Oh, is that how we're playing this, then? Jacob - 13/05/2011 07:02:35 PM 916 Views
I'm not playing. I'm pointing out some glaring errors on your part. Tom - 13/05/2011 07:25:08 PM 836 Views
Danny will correct me if I'm wrong, but... Legolas - 13/05/2011 09:55:14 PM 1031 Views
Danny persistently refuses to say that Tom - 13/05/2011 10:13:55 PM 965 Views
And with respect to your textual point, once again you're wrong Tom - 12/05/2011 07:44:10 PM 1057 Views
The Bible says what it says. The problem... people like to tell us just what else it's saying. Jacob - 13/05/2011 05:31:29 PM 902 Views
You're a fucking moron. *NM* Dan - 15/05/2011 11:11:08 PM 419 Views
You make a very important but too often overlooked point. Joel - 14/05/2011 01:54:40 AM 1040 Views
??? the bible was harsher on homosexulaity than on rape random thoughts - 12/05/2011 06:56:43 PM 895 Views
Read Judges. Dannymac - 12/05/2011 07:17:29 PM 900 Views
You don't reconcile... you pick the parts you like and adjust the rest to suit you. TaskmasterJack - 13/05/2011 09:33:54 PM 823 Views
And you add in some New Age music and a little ankh as well *NM* Tom - 14/05/2011 02:35:27 AM 407 Views
Another example... Bramhodoulos - 12/05/2011 09:19:52 AM 825 Views
That's what people said about churches opposing slavery. Dannymac - 12/05/2011 04:06:26 PM 889 Views
I rest my case *NM* Bramhodoulos - 12/05/2011 04:48:32 PM 388 Views
That is a false dichotomy and we both know it. Joel - 14/05/2011 02:07:19 AM 883 Views
If you claim to follow the entire Bible, then you are completely correct. Tom - 12/05/2011 06:04:38 PM 819 Views
On the contrary, this move will take some butts out of the seats. Dannymac - 12/05/2011 07:16:22 PM 877 Views
We both know that isn't the case Tom - 12/05/2011 07:55:41 PM 983 Views
Whatever your issue is, get over it. Dannymac - 13/05/2011 06:17:26 PM 836 Views
You'd be a lot more effective... Jacob - 13/05/2011 06:45:31 PM 951 Views
You haven't adequately expressed your theology Tom - 13/05/2011 07:28:54 PM 935 Views
Cool cool. I have a question on a semi-related note, about Protestant Gospels beetnemesis - 12/05/2011 05:33:49 PM 935 Views
No Protestant denomination has added so much as a word to the Bible Tom - 12/05/2011 05:58:16 PM 819 Views
So, everyone hates Judith, then? beetnemesis - 12/05/2011 06:40:11 PM 896 Views
The Catholics and Eastern Orthodox Churches accept Judith as part of Scripture. Tom - 12/05/2011 07:51:27 PM 840 Views
Does the Eastern Orthodox Church also segregate deuterocanonical works like Roman Catholicism does? Joel - 14/05/2011 02:19:03 AM 1154 Views
The Eastern Church bases everything on the Septuagint. Tom - 14/05/2011 02:34:41 AM 898 Views
That sounds appealing, and makes sense. Joel - 14/05/2011 02:44:56 AM 907 Views
Oh, I just enjoy calling Protestants "heretics" to remind them not everyone agrees with them. Tom - 14/05/2011 03:25:42 AM 858 Views
Oh, but they know that; in many cases, they exult in it. Joel - 14/05/2011 06:06:01 AM 852 Views
Re: Cool cool. I have a question on a semi-related note, about Protestant Gospels Isaac - 12/05/2011 08:52:48 PM 877 Views
The NIV is terrible. The NASB has the best translation I have found (of the NT, at least). Ghavrel - 12/05/2011 10:43:58 PM 1025 Views
I find this really weird, to be honest beetnemesis - 13/05/2011 05:48:28 AM 930 Views
Well, it wasn't just Athanasius. But yes, we are lucky in that respect. *NM* Ghavrel - 13/05/2011 06:32:48 AM 370 Views
Athanasius's list reflected the victory of Pauline Christianity Tom - 13/05/2011 02:52:53 PM 848 Views
There's a school of thought that says that's a strong vindication of Athanasius. Joel - 14/05/2011 02:37:49 AM 800 Views
Since I haven't gotten around to asking yet... Isaac - 13/05/2011 07:14:01 PM 846 Views
Re: Since I haven't gotten around to asking yet... Dannymac - 15/05/2011 03:18:23 PM 1260 Views
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