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Re: Good point ... DomA Send a noteboard - 11/05/2010 03:43:43 PM
I don't recall if there was ever any discussion of this, in TSR when it happened or later when the two went to Salidar.


There wasn't except allusions that Siuan felt guilty for Leanne's fate, because Leanne would have none of that and always stood by her decision to cover up Siuan's secret dealings with ta'veren the Hall deemed dangerous. She didn't know the secrets, but she very well knew Siuan was secretely scheming with Moiraine and others, and she turned a blind eye to that by choice/loyalty. The Hall might have considered her all the more guilty/irresponsible for covering up schemes she knew were ongoing but didn't know the nature of, except they involved individuals and situations that worried the Hall.

There wasn't any trial because Alviarin well knew that the "stilling offenses" against Siuan and Leanne (freeing Taim etc. - Elaida can't lie, so she must have gotten false evidence of some kind or another to bring up that accusation. Likely Alviarin cooked up something about sisters Siuan had sent to capture Taim not unlike the lies Siuan cooked up later against Elaida and the Reds) were invented and would fall apart in a trial in which Siuan, who can't lie, could flat out answer any questions from the Hall about that, leaving only her secret dealings with the ta'veren and having made all sort of executive decisions concerning TDR without involving the Hall (and where she was within her power and where she wasn't is a very murky area at best. We just don't know.). Siuan's actions probably justified her removal from office, or the Hall would have tried to blackmail her into becoming their puppet, but it's the stole Elaida wanted, and the others were seemingly blinded by the influence over the course of events and decisions they thought they'd get by electing her in such a weak position, as evidenced by their "council" later on, and to make that happen they were quite content to break the rules about Siuan's trial. They probably suspected all along that Siuan might wriggle out of the accusations if they let her defend herself, at least enough to deadlock the Hall. Their minds were made that she had to go and Elaida had to be elected in her place, so they overlooked the law. The sentence of stilling was most likely pronounced not with Justice in mind, but in the full knowledge thay their position was weak and they had make sure there wasn't any way to undo what they were about to do. They probably didn't foresee the split, but they sure foresaw that a pro-Siuan faction would fight back, but they thought by stilling Siuan they killed its chances in the bud and they would reconcile themselves to Elaida's election. The other related reason to expedite Siuan's trial was of course that Elaida's cabal didn't want to risk the full Hall to be assembled, so they expedited the removal, the election, the secret trials and sentences all in one sitting. The sentence itself was apparently carried out in secret as well.
This message last edited by DomA on 11/05/2010 at 03:47:06 PM
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Character discussion 2 : Siuan Sanche and Leane Sharif - 09/05/2010 06:01:33 PM 5328 Views
The "Shrinking of Siuan" after stilling destroyed my initial awe for the Amyrlin positition... - 09/05/2010 07:07:09 PM 1265 Views
yeah, but then again ... - 09/05/2010 09:05:36 PM 1004 Views
That's total nonsense... - 10/05/2010 08:34:08 AM 1246 Views
No, THAT's total nonsense... - 10/05/2010 09:27:41 AM 1121 Views
He raised other issues too - 10/05/2010 11:04:52 AM 1117 Views
You seem to deal in bad analogies... - 10/05/2010 05:14:47 PM 1129 Views
You've got an irritating manner about you. No wonder you find Aes Sedai so believable. - 10/05/2010 05:53:00 PM 981 Views
Hello Pot. I'm Kettle. - 10/05/2010 06:41:58 PM 1000 Views
Hello Kettle. I'm Frying pan *NM* - 11/05/2010 03:43:20 PM 542 Views
Hello Frying pan. I'm Skillet. *NM* - 12/05/2010 11:50:33 PM 557 Views
I usually agree about his manner, but he's right here. - 12/05/2010 04:24:28 AM 1091 Views
Re: No, THAT's total nonsense... - 19/05/2010 04:39:07 PM 1034 Views
I think you're looking at it the wrong way. - 12/05/2010 06:32:00 AM 1035 Views
Both wonderful characters... - 10/05/2010 12:49:44 AM 949 Views
They deserved to be deposed and stilled, I think ... - 10/05/2010 02:47:35 PM 1156 Views
"They"? - 10/05/2010 05:16:54 PM 1058 Views
Good point ... - 10/05/2010 06:45:52 PM 1206 Views
Re: Good point ... - 10/05/2010 06:49:19 PM 1073 Views
Re: Good point ... - 11/05/2010 03:43:43 PM 1241 Views
Leanne was not an Overseer - 17/05/2010 02:40:45 AM 1070 Views
Re: "They"? - 11/05/2010 02:53:23 PM 1121 Views
And she was eventually brought in on the secrets as well... - 12/05/2010 04:38:52 AM 1079 Views
I don't know if I agree with this - 11/05/2010 03:19:20 PM 1093 Views
The thing is ... - 11/05/2010 09:06:15 PM 1032 Views
I get what you are saying, but the quote is from much earlier - 14/05/2010 03:14:17 PM 851 Views
I totally unagree... - 17/05/2010 11:16:50 AM 1334 Views
I like Leane, and respected Siuan until RJ mauled her character - 10/05/2010 05:55:08 PM 1001 Views
She was probably the sacrificial lamb in place of Moiraine - 10/05/2010 06:25:39 PM 959 Views
The deck was certainly stacked against Siuan from the very beginning - 11/05/2010 02:44:05 PM 1047 Views
This is a main reason I hope Siuan and Leanne get their full strength restored - 11/05/2010 02:25:31 PM 1049 Views
I don't really agree - 11/05/2010 05:35:44 PM 995 Views
Re: I don't really agree - 11/05/2010 06:28:48 PM 1112 Views
I hope so, as well. - 13/05/2010 05:31:36 PM 1028 Views
Re: Character discussion 2 : Siuan Sanche and Leane Sharif - 11/05/2010 05:06:51 PM 1539 Views
I'm still annoyed that Siuan is not going to face the consequences of lying about the Reds. - 12/05/2010 05:18:47 AM 1051 Views
In Egwene's defense, it would be hypocritical of her to bring that up after profiting from it - 12/05/2010 05:59:57 AM 1044 Views
Oh, I never expected Egwene to do something about this. - 12/05/2010 06:12:35 AM 919 Views
Well she's off forging a relationship with the Asha'man - you know, useful stuff? *NM* - 12/05/2010 06:39:04 AM 608 Views
Are you claiming that Pevara was the only woman in the entire Red Ajah to be offended by that lie? *NM* - 12/05/2010 07:15:40 AM 552 Views
The Reds aren't petty - 12/05/2010 04:52:50 PM 910 Views
Are you kidding? - 12/05/2010 06:14:46 PM 1057 Views
Unless of course there is truth to it - 17/05/2010 01:50:27 PM 1046 Views
There is none. - 17/05/2010 07:09:59 PM 1026 Views
Uhhh? - 17/05/2010 08:45:15 PM 935 Views
... - 17/05/2010 11:08:05 PM 1070 Views
Re: ... - 18/05/2010 05:25:33 AM 1006 Views
Seriously, are you kidding? [EDIT] - 18/05/2010 06:06:01 AM 1014 Views
*sigh* - 18/05/2010 12:30:43 PM 1084 Views
So, you're not kidding. - 18/05/2010 09:12:27 PM 953 Views
Re: So, you're not kidding. - 18/05/2010 10:25:19 PM 989 Views
Re: So, you're not kidding. - 19/05/2010 12:41:09 AM 1076 Views
So, Tsutama... - 19/05/2010 05:29:56 PM 1143 Views
Ugh. - 20/05/2010 04:05:43 AM 897 Views
WTF? - 20/05/2010 05:25:42 PM 961 Views
F-T is right - 19/05/2010 12:32:33 AM 1066 Views
On the minority thing... - 18/05/2010 04:26:15 PM 1046 Views
That's exactly the problem. - 18/05/2010 08:51:45 PM 897 Views
There is no rewriting... - 18/05/2010 08:57:50 PM 905 Views
Re: There is no rewriting... - 18/05/2010 09:21:31 PM 1011 Views
Really do you have a quote supporting the fact that there has never been a FD supported by a Red? - 18/05/2010 09:39:31 PM 1044 Views
Of course..., I'll provide it as soon as you prove you're not a Nazi serial child rapist. - 18/05/2010 10:06:23 PM 863 Views
why so pissy? - 19/05/2010 03:34:22 PM 1030 Views
Sorry. - 20/05/2010 04:16:43 AM 955 Views
Re: Sorry. - 20/05/2010 08:19:13 AM 851 Views
Re: Sorry. - 20/05/2010 08:33:54 AM 1086 Views
Re: Sorry. - 20/05/2010 01:26:47 PM 870 Views
Interesting. - 20/05/2010 07:34:45 PM 958 Views
Re: Interesting. - 21/05/2010 05:07:07 AM 982 Views
Re: Interesting. - 21/05/2010 06:28:05 AM 918 Views
LOL - 21/05/2010 02:50:29 PM 926 Views
... - 21/05/2010 08:23:08 PM 1112 Views
There may be one explanation... - 13/05/2010 10:04:46 PM 939 Views
That doesn't make sense. - 13/05/2010 10:54:53 PM 1086 Views
it was about more than just male channelers - 18/05/2010 09:50:14 PM 1123 Views
Yes, that's true. - 18/05/2010 10:07:22 PM 1101 Views
I'm also certain the majority of the Red had no clue/involvement - 20/05/2010 10:24:54 PM 981 Views
That's also true. - 20/05/2010 10:29:11 PM 966 Views
Okay I'm leaving you alone ... you clearly don't want to continue - 20/05/2010 10:31:01 PM 972 Views
Why are they lumped together? - 12/05/2010 05:53:51 AM 1246 Views
for practical purposes - 12/05/2010 04:50:48 PM 937 Views
AS shrunk after stilling; Siuan and Leane became huge. - 12/05/2010 10:50:50 PM 966 Views
Re: AS shrunk after stilling; Siuan and Leane became huge. - 12/05/2010 11:05:17 PM 1081 Views
No, I don't think so - 13/05/2010 05:10:03 AM 904 Views
Let's just say we disagree. - 17/05/2010 11:15:31 PM 1027 Views
Bah! - 18/05/2010 04:33:40 PM 986 Views
Pfft - 18/05/2010 05:31:16 PM 1009 Views
You don't have to intimidate people to manipulate them. - 19/05/2010 12:46:02 AM 838 Views

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