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Yes, that's true. Fanatic-Templar Send a noteboard - 18/05/2010 10:07:22 PM
I mean, it's technically possible that this would happen in future books, but after Egwene goes for her whole 'Healer of Division' routine and nobody in the White Tower had the minimum necessary intellect to bring this up - including the Reds and Elaida - I have very little confidence in this ever being brought up again.


Maybe the Reds, in general, don't want to bring it up because they are worried Siuan will drag out stuff about what they did during the vileness.

During Egwene's debate with Elaida, for example, this was not brought up because Elaida was probably worried that Egwene would bring up the vileness, and she doesn't want the Sitters to remember that now, does she?

Also, the few names we heard from Logain are likely Blacks. For all we know, a few Black-Reds did indeed encourage Logain on orders from the Supreme Council, and people like Pevara just did not know.


The vileness was about killing male channelers on the spot, as far as I recall, not supporting them. But either way, Egwene has already been spreading slanderous accusations against Elaida, why would she fear breaking the holy persona Egwene was building for herself, if the only repercussions would be more of the same? Egwene was the one in danger here - her entire position was built on 'this division of the Tower is an evil thing, I intend to heal it', launching such an accusation, targeted directly at the Reds would reveal her to be just another power-hungry woman ready to turn against fellow Sisters just to get ahead. Her entire platform would have been ruined. Elaida has nothing to lose.

Though to be frank, I don't expect Elaida to have thought this carefully through. She was visibly enraged and acting thoughtlessly, she would not have considered the advantages I've shown any more than she would have considered the possibilities you brought up. She should have just shouted the accusations at Egwene or something.

As for you suggesting the lies are true, you're just grasping at straws. Fabrications are not true until proven false, and there is absolutely nothing to indicate that this is true. Only those deceived by Logain and Siuan ever think of it as true, and that's precisely because they are deceived.

Even if it were true that changes nothing! Elaida is not a Darkfriend, nor are most of the Reds in the Tower.


2 (or 3) Amyrlins and about a dozen senior Sisters (at the least) also died in rapid succession ... and not all killed by the Black ... Chesmal convinced Reds to kill Sieren when she thought she was going to be caught as BA. The vileness went much deeper than a few male channelers being Gentled without trial!
The first rule of being a ninja is "do no harm". Unless you intend to do harm, then do lots of harm.
~Master Splinter

Victorious in Bergioyn's legendary 'Reverse Mafia'. *MySmiley*
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Character discussion 2 : Siuan Sanche and Leane Sharif - 09/05/2010 06:01:33 PM 5370 Views
The "Shrinking of Siuan" after stilling destroyed my initial awe for the Amyrlin positition... - 09/05/2010 07:07:09 PM 1295 Views
yeah, but then again ... - 09/05/2010 09:05:36 PM 1022 Views
That's total nonsense... - 10/05/2010 08:34:08 AM 1260 Views
No, THAT's total nonsense... - 10/05/2010 09:27:41 AM 1143 Views
He raised other issues too - 10/05/2010 11:04:52 AM 1137 Views
You seem to deal in bad analogies... - 10/05/2010 05:14:47 PM 1147 Views
You've got an irritating manner about you. No wonder you find Aes Sedai so believable. - 10/05/2010 05:53:00 PM 1001 Views
Hello Pot. I'm Kettle. - 10/05/2010 06:41:58 PM 1024 Views
Hello Kettle. I'm Frying pan *NM* - 11/05/2010 03:43:20 PM 554 Views
Hello Frying pan. I'm Skillet. *NM* - 12/05/2010 11:50:33 PM 567 Views
I usually agree about his manner, but he's right here. - 12/05/2010 04:24:28 AM 1126 Views
Re: No, THAT's total nonsense... - 19/05/2010 04:39:07 PM 1050 Views
I think you're looking at it the wrong way. - 12/05/2010 06:32:00 AM 1058 Views
Both wonderful characters... - 10/05/2010 12:49:44 AM 964 Views
They deserved to be deposed and stilled, I think ... - 10/05/2010 02:47:35 PM 1175 Views
"They"? - 10/05/2010 05:16:54 PM 1081 Views
Good point ... - 10/05/2010 06:45:52 PM 1236 Views
Re: Good point ... - 10/05/2010 06:49:19 PM 1095 Views
Re: Good point ... - 11/05/2010 03:43:43 PM 1262 Views
Leanne was not an Overseer - 17/05/2010 02:40:45 AM 1088 Views
Re: "They"? - 11/05/2010 02:53:23 PM 1148 Views
And she was eventually brought in on the secrets as well... - 12/05/2010 04:38:52 AM 1101 Views
I don't know if I agree with this - 11/05/2010 03:19:20 PM 1118 Views
The thing is ... - 11/05/2010 09:06:15 PM 1052 Views
I get what you are saying, but the quote is from much earlier - 14/05/2010 03:14:17 PM 868 Views
I totally unagree... - 17/05/2010 11:16:50 AM 1351 Views
I like Leane, and respected Siuan until RJ mauled her character - 10/05/2010 05:55:08 PM 1026 Views
She was probably the sacrificial lamb in place of Moiraine - 10/05/2010 06:25:39 PM 982 Views
The deck was certainly stacked against Siuan from the very beginning - 11/05/2010 02:44:05 PM 1067 Views
This is a main reason I hope Siuan and Leanne get their full strength restored - 11/05/2010 02:25:31 PM 1065 Views
I don't really agree - 11/05/2010 05:35:44 PM 1017 Views
Re: I don't really agree - 11/05/2010 06:28:48 PM 1132 Views
I hope so, as well. - 13/05/2010 05:31:36 PM 1049 Views
Re: Character discussion 2 : Siuan Sanche and Leane Sharif - 11/05/2010 05:06:51 PM 1617 Views
I'm still annoyed that Siuan is not going to face the consequences of lying about the Reds. - 12/05/2010 05:18:47 AM 1072 Views
In Egwene's defense, it would be hypocritical of her to bring that up after profiting from it - 12/05/2010 05:59:57 AM 1064 Views
Oh, I never expected Egwene to do something about this. - 12/05/2010 06:12:35 AM 942 Views
Well she's off forging a relationship with the Asha'man - you know, useful stuff? *NM* - 12/05/2010 06:39:04 AM 617 Views
Are you claiming that Pevara was the only woman in the entire Red Ajah to be offended by that lie? *NM* - 12/05/2010 07:15:40 AM 561 Views
The Reds aren't petty - 12/05/2010 04:52:50 PM 929 Views
Are you kidding? - 12/05/2010 06:14:46 PM 1092 Views
Unless of course there is truth to it - 17/05/2010 01:50:27 PM 1070 Views
There is none. - 17/05/2010 07:09:59 PM 1044 Views
Uhhh? - 17/05/2010 08:45:15 PM 956 Views
... - 17/05/2010 11:08:05 PM 1094 Views
Re: ... - 18/05/2010 05:25:33 AM 1030 Views
Seriously, are you kidding? [EDIT] - 18/05/2010 06:06:01 AM 1032 Views
*sigh* - 18/05/2010 12:30:43 PM 1108 Views
So, you're not kidding. - 18/05/2010 09:12:27 PM 971 Views
Re: So, you're not kidding. - 18/05/2010 10:25:19 PM 1005 Views
Re: So, you're not kidding. - 19/05/2010 12:41:09 AM 1097 Views
So, Tsutama... - 19/05/2010 05:29:56 PM 1170 Views
Ugh. - 20/05/2010 04:05:43 AM 917 Views
WTF? - 20/05/2010 05:25:42 PM 988 Views
F-T is right - 19/05/2010 12:32:33 AM 1085 Views
On the minority thing... - 18/05/2010 04:26:15 PM 1063 Views
That's exactly the problem. - 18/05/2010 08:51:45 PM 917 Views
There is no rewriting... - 18/05/2010 08:57:50 PM 924 Views
Re: There is no rewriting... - 18/05/2010 09:21:31 PM 1027 Views
Really do you have a quote supporting the fact that there has never been a FD supported by a Red? - 18/05/2010 09:39:31 PM 1073 Views
Of course..., I'll provide it as soon as you prove you're not a Nazi serial child rapist. - 18/05/2010 10:06:23 PM 880 Views
why so pissy? - 19/05/2010 03:34:22 PM 1057 Views
Sorry. - 20/05/2010 04:16:43 AM 979 Views
Re: Sorry. - 20/05/2010 08:19:13 AM 867 Views
Re: Sorry. - 20/05/2010 08:33:54 AM 1113 Views
Re: Sorry. - 20/05/2010 01:26:47 PM 892 Views
Interesting. - 20/05/2010 07:34:45 PM 983 Views
Re: Interesting. - 21/05/2010 05:07:07 AM 1000 Views
Re: Interesting. - 21/05/2010 06:28:05 AM 937 Views
LOL - 21/05/2010 02:50:29 PM 942 Views
... - 21/05/2010 08:23:08 PM 1128 Views
There may be one explanation... - 13/05/2010 10:04:46 PM 960 Views
That doesn't make sense. - 13/05/2010 10:54:53 PM 1106 Views
it was about more than just male channelers - 18/05/2010 09:50:14 PM 1157 Views
Yes, that's true. - 18/05/2010 10:07:22 PM 1131 Views
I'm also certain the majority of the Red had no clue/involvement - 20/05/2010 10:24:54 PM 1017 Views
That's also true. - 20/05/2010 10:29:11 PM 985 Views
Okay I'm leaving you alone ... you clearly don't want to continue - 20/05/2010 10:31:01 PM 988 Views
Why are they lumped together? - 12/05/2010 05:53:51 AM 1270 Views
for practical purposes - 12/05/2010 04:50:48 PM 951 Views
AS shrunk after stilling; Siuan and Leane became huge. - 12/05/2010 10:50:50 PM 984 Views
Re: AS shrunk after stilling; Siuan and Leane became huge. - 12/05/2010 11:05:17 PM 1100 Views
No, I don't think so - 13/05/2010 05:10:03 AM 919 Views
Let's just say we disagree. - 17/05/2010 11:15:31 PM 1045 Views
Bah! - 18/05/2010 04:33:40 PM 1001 Views
Pfft - 18/05/2010 05:31:16 PM 1028 Views
You don't have to intimidate people to manipulate them. - 19/05/2010 12:46:02 AM 882 Views

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