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Too convulted...... Jeordam Send a noteboard - 14/07/2010 07:26:26 PM
From a literal standpoint it only makes sense that Graendal was killed by Rand. The "Graendal somehow survived"-theories (which remind of the ideas that Sammael or Osan'gar survived somehow) would be an unnecessary twist such late in the story. Considering that RJ wanted to wrap up things, it's clear that Graendal was balefired in a powerful scene, because she wasn't needed anymore and to emphasise Rand's hardness. As it is made clear in the book, Graendal simply couldn't predict that Rand would "punch her in the face" in such a way.

Besides that, Graendal tells in TGS, prologue, that Aran'gar doesn't know where her lair is. Thus nothing suggests that Aran'gar would go to Graendal (Aran'gar can certainly find other, more neutral refugees).


As in Slayer, a character who we knew nothing about in regards to his powers....was hanging out in a place which he hasn't been to for decades....was watching a man who he knew could channel and kill him...but was watching a man who's location was unknown to him prior to this...who happened to stumble upon him...who he killed and took the body, harp, and removed all evidence (blood, disrupted environment, etc).

And *this* is too confulted? ;)

I'm just saying.

As for a huge twist like this at the end of the series...unlikely, but possible. As for Graendal not being able to recognize that Rand would "punch her in the face"....who said she had too. 1) There was more than enough time for a regular exit...let alone a dramatic, jump-through-the-gateway type of exit. 2) Do you honestly think that Rand could out think Graendal? How many mid-20 year olds can out think a trained, experienced professional?

~Jeordam
ex-Admin at wotmania (all things wot & art galleries)
Saving the Princess, Humanity, or the World-Entire since 1985
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What about this little 'Graendal survived' theory? Sidious - 13/07/2010 09:00:05 AM 2276 Views
Too convulted to make any sense... Etzel - 13/07/2010 09:22:26 AM 1211 Views
Too convulted...... Jeordam - 14/07/2010 07:26:26 PM 1461 Views
The logic is rather... Etzel - 15/07/2010 05:09:30 PM 1123 Views
What is the reason Delana is with Graendal? Artsapat - 13/07/2010 09:31:36 AM 1296 Views
Indeed... Etzel - 13/07/2010 10:06:32 AM 1197 Views
Re: Indeed... Sidious - 13/07/2010 10:10:43 AM 1270 Views
That is wrong Etzel - 13/07/2010 10:19:32 AM 1107 Views
Re: That is wrong Sidious - 13/07/2010 10:29:16 AM 1200 Views
It's not at all... Etzel - 13/07/2010 10:35:49 AM 1073 Views
Plus... Etzel - 13/07/2010 12:18:12 PM 1012 Views
I agree with part and disagree with part. Logain - 14/07/2010 06:39:36 PM 1098 Views
exactly darius_sedai - 14/07/2010 06:43:14 PM 1096 Views
Does the Compulsion fit Graendal? Lohikaarme - 13/07/2010 03:40:36 PM 1145 Views
sorry but no dacole - 13/07/2010 09:49:13 AM 1220 Views
Exactly Etzel - 13/07/2010 10:14:06 AM 1062 Views
Yeah dacole provided powerful evidence *NM* Sidious - 13/07/2010 10:25:13 AM 589 Views
Actually... Etzel - 13/07/2010 10:30:24 AM 1105 Views
Or, as with Moghedien. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 13/07/2010 02:35:44 PM 1259 Views
It makes perfect sense. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 13/07/2010 02:33:09 PM 1127 Views
I won't be 100% sure she's dead until we get a solid "she's toast" from either the text darius_sedai - 13/07/2010 04:21:18 PM 1151 Views
This is actually the first thing that I thought of in that scene *NM* darius_sedai - 13/07/2010 04:08:48 PM 737 Views
Until I have absolute proof to the contrary.(Confirmation by Harriot or BS) krassos - 13/07/2010 04:20:49 PM 1048 Views
If Graendal didn't know Rand would use balefire, why would she have Delana do the Compulsion? beetnemesis - 13/07/2010 04:57:10 PM 1343 Views
Yes, Graendal completely outsmarted Rand. Fanatic-Templar - 13/07/2010 05:56:30 PM 1213 Views
I just think it's funny that people make fun of such a basic plan as convoluted. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 13/07/2010 06:33:44 PM 1197 Views
Indeed... imagine how a truly complex plan would confound them Sidious - 13/07/2010 08:41:54 PM 1116 Views
Re: Indeed... imagine how a truly complex plan would confound them Underwood - 13/07/2010 09:09:09 PM 1170 Views
You draw too much attention to yourself, Mr Underwood *NM* Sidious - 14/07/2010 05:13:42 AM 685 Views
Ha, nice! *NM* Underwood - 14/07/2010 04:05:00 PM 577 Views
What are you talking about? I was agreeing with you, it's absurdly simple. Fanatic-Templar - 13/07/2010 09:27:22 PM 1173 Views
Huh Sidious - 14/07/2010 05:22:51 AM 1161 Views
Why did the lair explode? Fanatic-Templar - 14/07/2010 06:17:32 AM 1127 Views
*NM* Skeeve the Great - 14/07/2010 01:58:17 PM 747 Views
While I generally agree with you...you missed an important detail. Mik - 14/07/2010 02:06:31 PM 1301 Views
What did Rand tell Ramshalan... Fanatic-Templar - 14/07/2010 04:29:04 PM 1011 Views
Re: What did Rand tell Ramshalan... darius_sedai - 14/07/2010 04:52:11 PM 1104 Views
... Fanatic-Templar - 14/07/2010 09:22:21 PM 1279 Views
he doesn't have to read Rands mind darius_sedai - 14/07/2010 09:41:59 PM 1037 Views
Provide a quote. Fanatic-Templar - 15/07/2010 04:10:06 AM 1171 Views
read the chapter darius_sedai - 10/08/2010 09:22:02 PM 1009 Views
Right, that's why I asked. Because I know you can't. Fanatic-Templar - 10/08/2010 10:00:14 PM 1157 Views
sigh ... always so aggressive ... why you gotta hate darius_sedai - 11/08/2010 03:23:31 AM 1232 Views
Was that what I asked for? Fanatic-Templar - 11/08/2010 04:05:41 AM 986 Views
sorry misunderstood what you were looking for darius_sedai - 11/08/2010 04:50:17 PM 1014 Views
Oh if that's what you want darius_sedai - 11/08/2010 04:45:19 PM 1142 Views
Yes, he pretty much says out loud that he can't just wipe out her fortress. Fanatic-Templar - 11/08/2010 06:57:39 PM 1057 Views
Re: Yes, he pretty much says out loud that he can't just wipe out her fortress. darius_sedai - 11/08/2010 09:20:10 PM 1042 Views
why does it have to be a well thought out plan? darius_sedai - 14/07/2010 04:14:17 PM 1035 Views
She would have to teach her pawn Compulsion. Fanatic-Templar - 14/07/2010 04:30:12 PM 1043 Views
No she'd only have to show Delana a weave to duplicate darius_sedai - 14/07/2010 04:48:24 PM 1089 Views
Nonsense. Fanatic-Templar - 14/07/2010 09:30:01 PM 1149 Views
yet Sorilea, can duplicate Cadsuane's weaves after one quick glance darius_sedai - 14/07/2010 09:52:01 PM 1146 Views
Which ones? Fanatic-Templar - 15/07/2010 04:14:23 AM 1029 Views
Re: Which ones? Sidious - 15/07/2010 05:25:28 AM 1132 Views
Well. Fanatic-Templar - 15/07/2010 06:53:29 AM 1011 Views
Actually I think it's one of those things that make AS so stupid darius_sedai - 10/08/2010 09:36:43 PM 1096 Views
the Sorilea moment is when they first meet Semirhage darius_sedai - 10/08/2010 09:32:26 PM 1186 Views
Thanks for the quote. Fanatic-Templar - 10/08/2010 10:02:36 PM 1232 Views
Re: I just think it's funny that people make fun of such a basic plan as convoluted. saidarisnowtainted - 14/07/2010 05:40:11 PM 1038 Views
She's so smart, she knows Rand will bring along Nynaeve to check Delana's Compulsion BlackAdder - 13/07/2010 08:32:19 PM 1018 Views
we've seen any number of times that a Channeler can make an exact copy of weaves darius_sedai - 14/07/2010 04:10:41 PM 1151 Views
Ramshalan didn't know the plan as you claim Skeeve the Great - 14/07/2010 04:16:29 PM 945 Views
he knew enough to alert Graendal to the danger darius_sedai - 14/07/2010 04:50:26 PM 1196 Views
No. Don't think so. Tom - 13/07/2010 08:35:34 PM 1013 Views
I so desperately want you to be right. Seriana Sedai - 14/07/2010 06:30:16 AM 1180 Views
Graendal being alive would make more of a statement... fionwe1987 - 14/07/2010 06:53:48 AM 1105 Views
Re: Graendal being alive would make more of a statement... Fanatic-Templar - 14/07/2010 07:10:49 AM 1171 Views
Re: Graendal being alive would make more of a statement... Seriana Sedai - 15/07/2010 10:50:05 PM 1107 Views
Yip Sidious - 14/07/2010 04:33:03 PM 1070 Views
Lame. eucatastrophe - 14/07/2010 10:44:47 AM 1005 Views
Not really darius_sedai - 14/07/2010 04:15:38 PM 964 Views
she's dead, get over it *NM* Yunalesca - 14/07/2010 01:12:15 PM 641 Views
Re: What about this little 'Graendal survived' theory? saidarisnowtainted - 14/07/2010 05:44:38 PM 1014 Views
Re: What about this little 'Graendal survived' theory? RugbyPlayingAshaman - 14/07/2010 07:21:29 PM 1108 Views
Re: What about this little 'Graendal survived' theory? saidarisnowtainted - 10/08/2010 09:12:17 PM 1203 Views
Sounds about right. Wonder if he intends to try and get Callandor? *NM* Lord Haart - 13/08/2010 07:41:47 AM 414 Views
*shrug* Seems a bit complex to me... Jeordam - 14/07/2010 07:17:49 PM 1412 Views
Re: What about this little 'Graendal survived' theory? Underwood - 15/07/2010 04:38:09 PM 1123 Views
Honestly, if she's still alive, how is she going to die? Gher - 16/07/2010 05:49:06 AM 1032 Views
Ahh, just remembered that some people think some Forsaken will survive Tarmon Gai'don. Still... *NM* Gher - 16/07/2010 05:51:41 AM 536 Views
Re: What about this little 'Graendal survived' theory? scooter - 10/11/2010 04:09:41 AM 1006 Views
Why? *Towers of Midnight spoilers* Fanatic-Templar - 10/11/2010 04:41:11 AM 981 Views
Because he was right, that's why. Terez - 11/11/2010 03:39:39 AM 976 Views
Not by my reckoning. *Still contains ToM spoilers* Fanatic-Templar - 11/11/2010 04:22:59 AM 962 Views
No one ever gets every detail right - it's impossible Terez - 11/11/2010 06:06:26 AM 1227 Views
Yes, but I don't think this was a detail. *Still ToM spoilers.* Fanatic-Templar - 11/11/2010 06:31:40 AM 1124 Views
Re: Why? *Towers of Midnight spoilers* scooter - 11/11/2010 04:12:38 AM 1106 Views
Please try to maintain some decorum. *Also ToM spoilers* Fanatic-Templar - 11/11/2010 04:45:08 AM 1043 Views
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