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sigh ... always so aggressive ... why you gotta hate darius_sedai Send a noteboard - 11/08/2010 03:23:31 AM
Again,

I suggest you reread that passage, what Rand says is that Graendal is so much smarter than him and that he has no way of matching her, and that he needs to get some allies who are more clever than her (to say nothing of that absurd idea about allying with Graendal, which she surely wouldn't buy after Sammael tried that trick), there is nothing that indicates that Rand is going to balefire her palace in the next few minutes (or days, or even weeks), everything in that conversation suggests Rand is stumped and is unable to find an answer to dealing with Graendal.


Incidentally, in order for Graendal to learn this, she would have to Compel Ramshalan. Given that you claim that she only thought of the channeling pawn scheme after getting information from Ramshalan, why would she have someone else Compel him in the first place? Again, it is impossible.

Either Graendal had someone else Compel Ramshalan from the moment he arrived, which would make anything she learned from him irrelevant, or she did Compel him, and your entire argument is moot.


All she had to do was hold a compulsion on him while interrogating him then release it and have someone else do the "bigger" job if she so chose. This is not a difficult concept she did much the same to Moghedien and Cyndane in WH.


Note what she did when threatened in POD... seems pretty standard

POD
New Alliances

She had spun the nets strong, for anger’s sake, nearly strong enough to do harm, and the women stood staring at her adoringly, eyes wide and mouths hanging open in adulation, intoxicated with worship. They were hers to command, now. If she told them to cut their own throats, they would. Suddenly Graendal realized that Moghedien was no longer embracing the Source. This much Compulsion might have shocked her into letting go. The servants by the door had not moved, of course.

"Now," she said a touch breathlessly, "you will answer my questions." She had a number, including who was this Moridin fellow, if there was such a man, and where had Cyndane come from, but one piqued her more than the rest. "What did you hope to gain by this, Moghedien? I may decide to knot those webs on you. You can pay for your game by serving me."

note that there is no permanent damage until she knots the webs, easy to see that she would have done something similar to Ramshalan and when she realized what was up had someone else finish the job while she packed up and ran.
Domani Drag Queen in the White Tower ... Aran'gar watch out!
This message last edited by darius_sedai on 11/08/2010 at 03:43:00 AM
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What about this little 'Graendal survived' theory? Sidious - 13/07/2010 09:00:05 AM 2087 Views
Too convulted to make any sense... Etzel - 13/07/2010 09:22:26 AM 1048 Views
Too convulted...... Jeordam - 14/07/2010 07:26:26 PM 1252 Views
The logic is rather... Etzel - 15/07/2010 05:09:30 PM 944 Views
What is the reason Delana is with Graendal? Artsapat - 13/07/2010 09:31:36 AM 1116 Views
Indeed... Etzel - 13/07/2010 10:06:32 AM 1029 Views
Re: Indeed... Sidious - 13/07/2010 10:10:43 AM 1065 Views
That is wrong Etzel - 13/07/2010 10:19:32 AM 898 Views
Re: That is wrong Sidious - 13/07/2010 10:29:16 AM 995 Views
It's not at all... Etzel - 13/07/2010 10:35:49 AM 898 Views
Plus... Etzel - 13/07/2010 12:18:12 PM 828 Views
I agree with part and disagree with part. Logain - 14/07/2010 06:39:36 PM 906 Views
exactly darius_sedai - 14/07/2010 06:43:14 PM 919 Views
Does the Compulsion fit Graendal? Lohikaarme - 13/07/2010 03:40:36 PM 968 Views
sorry but no dacole - 13/07/2010 09:49:13 AM 1028 Views
Exactly Etzel - 13/07/2010 10:14:06 AM 889 Views
Yeah dacole provided powerful evidence *NM* Sidious - 13/07/2010 10:25:13 AM 494 Views
Actually... Etzel - 13/07/2010 10:30:24 AM 938 Views
Or, as with Moghedien. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 13/07/2010 02:35:44 PM 1083 Views
It makes perfect sense. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 13/07/2010 02:33:09 PM 948 Views
I won't be 100% sure she's dead until we get a solid "she's toast" from either the text darius_sedai - 13/07/2010 04:21:18 PM 960 Views
This is actually the first thing that I thought of in that scene *NM* darius_sedai - 13/07/2010 04:08:48 PM 628 Views
Until I have absolute proof to the contrary.(Confirmation by Harriot or BS) krassos - 13/07/2010 04:20:49 PM 872 Views
If Graendal didn't know Rand would use balefire, why would she have Delana do the Compulsion? beetnemesis - 13/07/2010 04:57:10 PM 1132 Views
Yes, Graendal completely outsmarted Rand. Fanatic-Templar - 13/07/2010 05:56:30 PM 1049 Views
I just think it's funny that people make fun of such a basic plan as convoluted. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 13/07/2010 06:33:44 PM 1015 Views
Indeed... imagine how a truly complex plan would confound them Sidious - 13/07/2010 08:41:54 PM 911 Views
Re: Indeed... imagine how a truly complex plan would confound them Underwood - 13/07/2010 09:09:09 PM 990 Views
You draw too much attention to yourself, Mr Underwood *NM* Sidious - 14/07/2010 05:13:42 AM 595 Views
Ha, nice! *NM* Underwood - 14/07/2010 04:05:00 PM 493 Views
What are you talking about? I was agreeing with you, it's absurdly simple. Fanatic-Templar - 13/07/2010 09:27:22 PM 996 Views
Huh Sidious - 14/07/2010 05:22:51 AM 984 Views
Why did the lair explode? Fanatic-Templar - 14/07/2010 06:17:32 AM 922 Views
*NM* Skeeve the Great - 14/07/2010 01:58:17 PM 645 Views
While I generally agree with you...you missed an important detail. Mik - 14/07/2010 02:06:31 PM 1112 Views
What did Rand tell Ramshalan... Fanatic-Templar - 14/07/2010 04:29:04 PM 826 Views
Re: What did Rand tell Ramshalan... darius_sedai - 14/07/2010 04:52:11 PM 917 Views
... Fanatic-Templar - 14/07/2010 09:22:21 PM 1102 Views
he doesn't have to read Rands mind darius_sedai - 14/07/2010 09:41:59 PM 869 Views
Provide a quote. Fanatic-Templar - 15/07/2010 04:10:06 AM 1005 Views
read the chapter darius_sedai - 10/08/2010 09:22:02 PM 831 Views
Right, that's why I asked. Because I know you can't. Fanatic-Templar - 10/08/2010 10:00:14 PM 952 Views
sigh ... always so aggressive ... why you gotta hate darius_sedai - 11/08/2010 03:23:31 AM 1050 Views
Was that what I asked for? Fanatic-Templar - 11/08/2010 04:05:41 AM 803 Views
sorry misunderstood what you were looking for darius_sedai - 11/08/2010 04:50:17 PM 833 Views
Oh if that's what you want darius_sedai - 11/08/2010 04:45:19 PM 971 Views
Yes, he pretty much says out loud that he can't just wipe out her fortress. Fanatic-Templar - 11/08/2010 06:57:39 PM 885 Views
Re: Yes, he pretty much says out loud that he can't just wipe out her fortress. darius_sedai - 11/08/2010 09:20:10 PM 877 Views
why does it have to be a well thought out plan? darius_sedai - 14/07/2010 04:14:17 PM 837 Views
She would have to teach her pawn Compulsion. Fanatic-Templar - 14/07/2010 04:30:12 PM 805 Views
No she'd only have to show Delana a weave to duplicate darius_sedai - 14/07/2010 04:48:24 PM 925 Views
Nonsense. Fanatic-Templar - 14/07/2010 09:30:01 PM 974 Views
yet Sorilea, can duplicate Cadsuane's weaves after one quick glance darius_sedai - 14/07/2010 09:52:01 PM 970 Views
Which ones? Fanatic-Templar - 15/07/2010 04:14:23 AM 852 Views
Re: Which ones? Sidious - 15/07/2010 05:25:28 AM 950 Views
Well. Fanatic-Templar - 15/07/2010 06:53:29 AM 826 Views
Actually I think it's one of those things that make AS so stupid darius_sedai - 10/08/2010 09:36:43 PM 923 Views
the Sorilea moment is when they first meet Semirhage darius_sedai - 10/08/2010 09:32:26 PM 970 Views
Thanks for the quote. Fanatic-Templar - 10/08/2010 10:02:36 PM 1040 Views
Re: I just think it's funny that people make fun of such a basic plan as convoluted. saidarisnowtainted - 14/07/2010 05:40:11 PM 851 Views
She's so smart, she knows Rand will bring along Nynaeve to check Delana's Compulsion BlackAdder - 13/07/2010 08:32:19 PM 865 Views
we've seen any number of times that a Channeler can make an exact copy of weaves darius_sedai - 14/07/2010 04:10:41 PM 987 Views
Ramshalan didn't know the plan as you claim Skeeve the Great - 14/07/2010 04:16:29 PM 775 Views
he knew enough to alert Graendal to the danger darius_sedai - 14/07/2010 04:50:26 PM 1018 Views
No. Don't think so. Tom - 13/07/2010 08:35:34 PM 835 Views
I so desperately want you to be right. Seriana Sedai - 14/07/2010 06:30:16 AM 1000 Views
Graendal being alive would make more of a statement... fionwe1987 - 14/07/2010 06:53:48 AM 892 Views
Re: Graendal being alive would make more of a statement... Fanatic-Templar - 14/07/2010 07:10:49 AM 991 Views
Re: Graendal being alive would make more of a statement... Seriana Sedai - 15/07/2010 10:50:05 PM 908 Views
Yip Sidious - 14/07/2010 04:33:03 PM 894 Views
Lame. eucatastrophe - 14/07/2010 10:44:47 AM 841 Views
Not really darius_sedai - 14/07/2010 04:15:38 PM 795 Views
she's dead, get over it *NM* Yunalesca - 14/07/2010 01:12:15 PM 537 Views
Re: What about this little 'Graendal survived' theory? saidarisnowtainted - 14/07/2010 05:44:38 PM 843 Views
Re: What about this little 'Graendal survived' theory? RugbyPlayingAshaman - 14/07/2010 07:21:29 PM 929 Views
Re: What about this little 'Graendal survived' theory? saidarisnowtainted - 10/08/2010 09:12:17 PM 1035 Views
Sounds about right. Wonder if he intends to try and get Callandor? *NM* Lord Haart - 13/08/2010 07:41:47 AM 326 Views
*shrug* Seems a bit complex to me... Jeordam - 14/07/2010 07:17:49 PM 1214 Views
Re: What about this little 'Graendal survived' theory? Underwood - 15/07/2010 04:38:09 PM 950 Views
Honestly, if she's still alive, how is she going to die? Gher - 16/07/2010 05:49:06 AM 846 Views
Ahh, just remembered that some people think some Forsaken will survive Tarmon Gai'don. Still... *NM* Gher - 16/07/2010 05:51:41 AM 432 Views
Re: What about this little 'Graendal survived' theory? scooter - 10/11/2010 04:09:41 AM 823 Views
Why? *Towers of Midnight spoilers* Fanatic-Templar - 10/11/2010 04:41:11 AM 810 Views
Because he was right, that's why. Terez - 11/11/2010 03:39:39 AM 824 Views
Not by my reckoning. *Still contains ToM spoilers* Fanatic-Templar - 11/11/2010 04:22:59 AM 764 Views
No one ever gets every detail right - it's impossible Terez - 11/11/2010 06:06:26 AM 1046 Views
Yes, but I don't think this was a detail. *Still ToM spoilers.* Fanatic-Templar - 11/11/2010 06:31:40 AM 923 Views
Re: Why? *Towers of Midnight spoilers* scooter - 11/11/2010 04:12:38 AM 925 Views
Please try to maintain some decorum. *Also ToM spoilers* Fanatic-Templar - 11/11/2010 04:45:08 AM 873 Views
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