Egwene is noting Mesaana's strength of will in TAR when she makes the comment about not daring to face her alone ... she nearly lost her mind just minutes prior
As for Egwene facing Mesaana ... there are several comments around Egwene's plans and then there is the fact that she was alone when she thought Mesaana was coming for her.
Mesaana would need something grand to offset so many failures. Killing Egwene would work. That might send the White Tower back into division.
Gawyn had been mortified when she'd said she might use herself as bait. Dared she do so? She gripped the railing, standing above the Tower, above the city that depended on her, looking out on a world that needed her.
Something had to be done; Mesaana had to be drawn out. If what Saerin said was true, then the woman would be willing to fight directly—she wouldn't hide and poke from the shadows. Egwene's task, then, was to tempt her with an opportunity, one that didn't seem obvious, one she couldn't resist.
a plan which she shared with NO ONE
Then there is this:
She folded her arms beneath her breasts. He could almost feel the heat of her anger. "Your yelling has drawn half of the White Tower. They saw you captured. The assassin probably knows, now, about my weaves."
"Light, Egwene! You talk as if I did it on purpose. I was only trying to protect you."
"I didn't ask for your protection! I asked for your obedience! Gawyn, don't you see the opportunity we've missed? If you hadn't scared Mesaana away, she'd have walked into my traps!"
Making it even more clear that Egwene had a plan all her own ... you know as well as I do that an Amyrlin is not allowed to willingly put herself in danger so the Hall would never have approved of this.
then we have her direct statement:
"I have sisters researching everything we can find about Mesaana," Egwene continued. "She's not a warrior, Gawyn. She's an administrator, a planner. If I can confront her, I can defeat her. But we must find her first. Exposing myself is only one of my plans—and you are right, it is dangerous. But my precautions have been extensive."
Now consider that when Gawyn sets off her wards she is alone, no one else is in the room, just Egwene, waiting for Mesaana. She clearly thinks she can confront Mesaana 1:1 and come out victorious.
Personally I think she's being foolish, she's likely thinking in terms of their strength being close enough for Egwene to have a chance against a woman who is not a warrior, but realistically Mesaana should be far more skilled than Egwene.
In the end Mesaana was stupid and arrogant and played into Egwene's strength in TAR rather than attempt an OP duel ... odd, if as you say, she was so much stronger than Egwene, she could have easily finished the job this way. Why risk confronting a Dreamer in TAR when you should be able to manhandle her with your superior OP strength and knowledge?
As for Egwene facing Mesaana ... there are several comments around Egwene's plans and then there is the fact that she was alone when she thought Mesaana was coming for her.
Mesaana would need something grand to offset so many failures. Killing Egwene would work. That might send the White Tower back into division.
Gawyn had been mortified when she'd said she might use herself as bait. Dared she do so? She gripped the railing, standing above the Tower, above the city that depended on her, looking out on a world that needed her.
Something had to be done; Mesaana had to be drawn out. If what Saerin said was true, then the woman would be willing to fight directly—she wouldn't hide and poke from the shadows. Egwene's task, then, was to tempt her with an opportunity, one that didn't seem obvious, one she couldn't resist.
a plan which she shared with NO ONE
Then there is this:
She folded her arms beneath her breasts. He could almost feel the heat of her anger. "Your yelling has drawn half of the White Tower. They saw you captured. The assassin probably knows, now, about my weaves."
"Light, Egwene! You talk as if I did it on purpose. I was only trying to protect you."
"I didn't ask for your protection! I asked for your obedience! Gawyn, don't you see the opportunity we've missed? If you hadn't scared Mesaana away, she'd have walked into my traps!"
Making it even more clear that Egwene had a plan all her own ... you know as well as I do that an Amyrlin is not allowed to willingly put herself in danger so the Hall would never have approved of this.
then we have her direct statement:
"I have sisters researching everything we can find about Mesaana," Egwene continued. "She's not a warrior, Gawyn. She's an administrator, a planner. If I can confront her, I can defeat her. But we must find her first. Exposing myself is only one of my plans—and you are right, it is dangerous. But my precautions have been extensive."
Now consider that when Gawyn sets off her wards she is alone, no one else is in the room, just Egwene, waiting for Mesaana. She clearly thinks she can confront Mesaana 1:1 and come out victorious.
Personally I think she's being foolish, she's likely thinking in terms of their strength being close enough for Egwene to have a chance against a woman who is not a warrior, but realistically Mesaana should be far more skilled than Egwene.
In the end Mesaana was stupid and arrogant and played into Egwene's strength in TAR rather than attempt an OP duel ... odd, if as you say, she was so much stronger than Egwene, she could have easily finished the job this way. Why risk confronting a Dreamer in TAR when you should be able to manhandle her with your superior OP strength and knowledge?
As I said... an ambush! She prepared snares for Mesaana.
Egwene notes Mesaana's strength in the Power in TAR. After that she decides not to go for Mesaana directly.
Egwene is a dreamwalker. Why would Egwene not go for Mesaana there? If anything, TAR is the best place to ambush Mesaana. It's where Egwene is strongest! Clearly Mesaana stands so far above her that Egwene would be fish-bait even there.
Even if Egwene is as strong as Mesaana in the OP, I fail to see how she would have defeated her without skill in the real world. Mesaana is much more knowledgeable about saidar. It would have been a Cyndane/Alivia battle without the angreal.
Anyway... whatever... we've debated this before. Elayne had to pick up an angreal and draw through it to pass off as a Forsaken.
Wheel of Time board admin
Fan of Lanfear
Fan of Lanfear
This message last edited by Sidious on 20/11/2012 at 05:01:32 PM
How many standard deviations is Lanfear
- 15/11/2012 06:04:39 PM
2547 Views
Hmm...
- 15/11/2012 07:25:34 PM
1637 Views
see we CAN agree on stuff
- 15/11/2012 07:56:12 PM
1490 Views
- 18/11/2012 08:37:22 PM
1342 Views
- 15/11/2012 07:56:12 PM
1490 Views
- 18/11/2012 08:37:22 PM
1342 Views
Re:
- 18/11/2012 11:07:17 PM
1563 Views
- 18/11/2012 11:07:17 PM
1563 Views
Re:
- 19/11/2012 05:16:00 AM
1403 Views
- 19/11/2012 05:16:00 AM
1403 Views
Re:
- 19/11/2012 03:13:01 PM
1388 Views
- 19/11/2012 03:13:01 PM
1388 Views
They only reject 37.5%, not 62.5%
- 19/11/2012 03:19:19 PM
1434 Views
Re: They only reject 37.5%, not 62.5%
- 19/11/2012 04:01:43 PM
1602 Views
Re: They only reject 37.5%, not 62.5%
- 19/11/2012 09:04:04 PM
1368 Views
Hmmm...
- 20/11/2012 02:08:40 AM
1419 Views
Perhaps, but Egwene is also being a bit dramatic in the scene as she managed
- 20/11/2012 04:28:57 AM
1411 Views
Nope...
- 20/11/2012 03:13:13 PM
1477 Views
I believe she is being over dramatic
- 20/11/2012 03:26:24 PM
1334 Views
Keep believing that...
- 20/11/2012 03:30:14 PM
1471 Views
*shrugs*
- 20/11/2012 03:49:10 PM
1451 Views
Tired and forkroot are the same now?
- 20/11/2012 03:55:22 PM
1352 Views
No it's the literary device
- 20/11/2012 04:04:28 PM
1464 Views
Impossible. Daigian is exactly 0.32SD below the mean
- 19/11/2012 11:06:04 AM
1396 Views
You keep saying that, but it is either a linear or a non-linear distribution
- 19/11/2012 09:09:32 PM
1475 Views
That's the whole point. Thanks for finally seeing it.
- 19/11/2012 09:43:27 PM
1432 Views
keep believing that ... but you making up numbers isn't really relevant *NM*
- 20/11/2012 04:29:44 AM
863 Views
Please show me a number that is made up. The 0.32SD for Daigian is a rule of statistics.
- 20/11/2012 07:15:48 AM
1333 Views
Ugh. I hate power level discussions. For real world applications, it should be kind of meaningless
- 16/11/2012 10:28:49 PM
1332 Views
I don't really agree
- 18/11/2012 08:40:53 PM
1310 Views
Perhaps, but we've seen that a MUCH weaker Channeler can win in a duel
- 19/11/2012 09:13:48 PM
1344 Views
Re: Perhaps, but we've seen that a MUCH weaker Channeler can win in a duel
- 20/11/2012 08:10:01 AM
1336 Views
Since I've proven that it's not a normal distribution in units of absolute strength, SDs don't apply
- 17/11/2012 07:48:21 PM
1406 Views
You have proven nothing, except that you have an opinion *NM*
- 18/11/2012 02:21:35 AM
848 Views
You simply don't get it. It is mathematically a fact. There is no opinion involved.
- 18/11/2012 02:19:40 PM
1184 Views
Only because you've assigned numeric values. That you created.
- 18/11/2012 02:40:51 PM
1367 Views
It doesn't matter what figure you use...
- 18/11/2012 03:01:56 PM
1263 Views
What if Daigian is one third Lanfear's strength?
- 18/11/2012 04:37:58 PM
1399 Views
Sure you can
- 18/11/2012 10:09:31 PM
1389 Views
Re: Sure you can
- 18/11/2012 10:54:50 PM
1377 Views
You're right, though its 37.5%
- 19/11/2012 12:21:29 AM
1344 Views
Oops, typo!
- 19/11/2012 02:54:25 AM
1389 Views
Again, not possible, due to Daigian being just 0.3SD below the Mean
- 19/11/2012 08:37:01 AM
1342 Views
Egwene is definitely not 2x Amys...
- 19/11/2012 04:05:12 PM
1252 Views
Re: Egwene is definitely not 2x Amys...
- 19/11/2012 05:55:02 PM
1200 Views
Egwene is about as strong as Melaine and Amys combined
- 19/11/2012 09:19:50 PM
1322 Views
Re: Egwene is about as strong as Melaine and Amys combined
- 20/11/2012 02:11:26 AM
1405 Views
Forkroot in every case
- 20/11/2012 04:32:26 AM
1322 Views
No!
- 20/11/2012 03:15:16 PM
1337 Views
I'm not going to go re-read the books to you on this
- 20/11/2012 03:39:46 PM
1317 Views
You need to read it for yourself, since you're completely confused.
- 20/11/2012 03:54:26 PM
1326 Views
Not going to argue this with you.
- 20/11/2012 04:09:44 PM
1236 Views
Your own example disproved your point...
- 20/11/2012 04:39:25 PM
1375 Views
let's see, she's both asleep and would need hours to regain her strength
- 20/11/2012 04:43:17 PM
1265 Views
Enough!
- 20/11/2012 05:04:06 PM
1337 Views
LOL ... whatever. You go on believing that ... no one else sees it this way. *NM*
- 20/11/2012 05:20:52 PM
836 Views
Re: Your own example disproved your point...
- 20/11/2012 05:10:15 PM
1349 Views
Barasine + Katerine isn't that much less than
- 20/11/2012 05:26:31 PM
1350 Views
Re: Egwene is definitely not 2x Amys...
- 20/11/2012 02:26:47 AM
1277 Views
Re: Egwene is definitely not 2x Amys...
- 20/11/2012 09:03:40 AM
1328 Views
Re: Egwene is definitely not 2x Amys...
- 20/11/2012 02:59:08 PM
1343 Views
None of this is backed by any evidence...
- 20/11/2012 03:24:12 PM
1253 Views
who said Cadsuane was 1.5x Moiraine or more?
- 20/11/2012 04:03:13 PM
1277 Views
Nope...
- 20/11/2012 04:41:35 PM
1284 Views
wrong
- 20/11/2012 04:48:50 PM
1249 Views
Better evidence? LOL!
- 20/11/2012 03:18:55 PM
1327 Views
Huh? How did you come to that conclusion?
- 20/11/2012 04:40:56 PM
1319 Views
BEcause Cadsuane is close on the heels of Egwene?
- 20/11/2012 05:10:50 PM
1215 Views
I'm not arguing that. I agree that Cadsuane is pretty close to Egwene
- 20/11/2012 05:50:34 PM
1379 Views
Interesting, but let's go with your figures...
- 19/11/2012 06:54:54 AM
1397 Views
Indeed
- 19/11/2012 08:16:44 AM
1422 Views
Rand is sort of a special case
- 20/11/2012 04:25:02 AM
1298 Views
Regarding Mesaana...
- 20/11/2012 08:42:56 AM
1311 Views
You continue to mix two things
- 20/11/2012 03:24:44 PM
1225 Views
No
- 20/11/2012 04:54:19 PM
1483 Views
You are mistaken
- 20/11/2012 05:04:40 PM
1279 Views
Probably, but the AS have no idea what 37.5% means
- 19/11/2012 02:59:26 AM
1271 Views
It's irrelevant
- 19/11/2012 03:46:42 AM
1351 Views
Agreed. Daigian is the marker of the absolute bottom of Aes Sedai strength.
- 19/11/2012 06:55:41 AM
1314 Views
Daigian
- 19/11/2012 08:12:19 AM
1314 Views
It is a direct marker due to RJ's quote
- 19/11/2012 08:50:26 AM
1365 Views
You missed my point
- 19/11/2012 09:08:42 AM
1266 Views
Asmodean would never have made the comment about 13 weakest AS
- 20/11/2012 04:41:11 AM
1288 Views
Re: Asmodean would never have made the comment about 13 weakest AS
- 20/11/2012 09:07:49 AM
1250 Views
Re: Sure you can
- 19/11/2012 09:22:09 AM
1412 Views
Care to explain this...
- 19/11/2012 05:06:28 PM
1206 Views
Indeed
- 20/11/2012 07:16:37 AM
1420 Views
Explained far better than I ever could. Bravo.
- 20/11/2012 07:30:29 AM
1293 Views
Well duh.
- 20/11/2012 02:57:24 PM
1391 Views
Incorrect.
- 20/11/2012 04:28:07 PM
1383 Views
No
- 20/11/2012 04:44:16 PM
1358 Views
You're integrating without lower limits...
- 20/11/2012 02:55:06 PM
1332 Views
We are not talking about a normal distribution in any case
- 20/11/2012 04:44:24 AM
1170 Views
Re: We are not talking about a normal distribution in any case
- 20/11/2012 07:02:47 AM
1368 Views
You must tell me of this special math...
- 20/11/2012 03:10:09 PM
1255 Views
Re: You must tell me of this special math...
- 20/11/2012 04:29:40 PM
1317 Views
Morghase is a placeholder...
- 20/11/2012 04:45:42 PM
1407 Views
Well...
- 18/11/2012 08:43:59 PM
1380 Views
Re: Well...
- 19/11/2012 03:40:44 PM
1343 Views
Wow.
- 19/11/2012 03:53:47 PM
1381 Views
Well then you're both wrong I'm afraid
- 19/11/2012 06:09:36 PM
1315 Views
Re: Well then you're both wrong I'm afraid
- 19/11/2012 07:42:58 PM
1203 Views
this is why I think all of the Forsaken are very close in Power
- 20/11/2012 04:51:20 AM
1375 Views
Re: this is why I think all of the Forsaken are very close in Power
- 20/11/2012 02:45:18 PM
1295 Views
I think RJ went out of his way to keep strength a bit of a mystery
- 20/11/2012 08:42:44 PM
1331 Views
Math gurus...Is it possible to find the missing variable...
- 21/11/2012 05:12:24 PM
1321 Views
the problem is that the Mean is not going to tell us much really
- 22/11/2012 02:55:03 AM
1396 Views
Re: the problem is that the Mean is not going to tell us much really
- 22/11/2012 03:15:33 AM
1677 Views
I do not think you can calculate the Mean without knowing the Units of Power
- 22/11/2012 03:53:59 AM
1459 Views
