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I have to disagree in regards to Penny, she's a plot device and an annoying one at that. Variant Send a noteboard - 21/07/2011 01:15:33 AM


On a related note, I really like the new character Penny. No major player of course, but really lovable, naive and sweet. I hope she sticks around for a bit and Tyrion can watch out for her. If there is one thing I dislike about the series it is how easily interesting minor characters disappear (Bronn, for example).



Tyrion is depressed and suicidal for most of this book, but her innocence serves as a counterpoint to that downward spiral (like a conscience, as you say). My guess is that she will either die or be seriously injured, which will propel Tyrion's character arc. She isn't that well-developed as a character in my opinion, so I think that is her fate, to serve the development of Tyrion's character. I am totally open to hearing arguments to the contrary though.

The truth is, Penny running into Tyrion is so utterly contrived. Westeros and Essos are giant places. The odds of her running into Tyrion are so low that it is rather unbelievable that she happens to end up exactly where he is. Literally she ends up a few dining tables away from him as opposed to any other place in the entire world. It was already coincidental enough when Jorah just happens to be at the same place that Tyrion is. But now the jousting dwarf as well? Will they run into Tysha next?

Personally I love how it points out Tyrion's hypocrisy when it comes to the sexual attraction thing. For all Tyrions moaning about never being desired by beautiful women because he is a dwarf, he sure does not seem too eager to jump in the sack with Penny, his fellow dwarf, for exactly the same reason. You know if she had been a tall blonde Lyseni he would have been all over her in a minute, no matter how childish and innocent she was.
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A Dance with Dragons discussion thread - 11/07/2011 10:48:23 PM 6453 Views
Okay, first impressions. Basically spoiler-free, I suppose. - 11/07/2011 11:40:31 PM 2006 Views
I have it! *NM* - 12/07/2011 05:42:27 AM 1092 Views
A general question to get the discussion started: will two more books be enough? - 12/07/2011 02:22:52 PM 2208 Views
A very good question *major spoilers, then* - 12/07/2011 02:55:05 PM 2181 Views
Oh, come on. If anyone can do it, Martin can. - 15/07/2011 03:48:27 AM 1865 Views
It'll be tight. - 12/07/2011 04:32:39 PM 2173 Views
No but I think 3 will be possible - 26/07/2011 03:15:02 AM 1998 Views
what is Purple Wedding? *NM* - 27/07/2011 08:37:04 AM 976 Views
Joffrey and Margaery wedding - 27/07/2011 04:26:04 PM 2021 Views
Hero of the book? - 12/07/2011 10:12:02 PM 2319 Views
Lord Manderly gets my vote. - 12/07/2011 10:41:19 PM 2133 Views
Re: Hero of the book? - 12/07/2011 10:43:20 PM 1999 Views
Re: Hero of the book? - 12/07/2011 11:50:29 PM 1984 Views
Ohh, so that was what that was about. - 17/07/2011 07:08:19 PM 2019 Views
That's what I thought too. - 25/07/2011 01:48:50 AM 2019 Views
Victorian Greyjoy = Hero of the book *NM* - 21/07/2011 06:20:25 AM 1157 Views
Asshole of the book? - 12/07/2011 10:46:10 PM 2194 Views
Agreed. - 12/07/2011 11:18:07 PM 2129 Views
Yeah, little doubt there. - 17/07/2011 07:09:53 PM 1970 Views
Seriously... - 18/07/2011 03:07:47 AM 1968 Views
Daenerys Targaryen & lifetime achievement award to Lord Rickard Stark - 17/08/2011 12:38:40 AM 1915 Views
Idiot of the book. - 12/07/2011 11:21:51 PM 2224 Views
lol yep, definitely *NM* - 13/07/2011 08:12:42 AM 1093 Views
Re: Idiot of the book. - 17/07/2011 12:42:20 AM 2080 Views
Wait... no she doesn't! - 17/07/2011 01:29:52 AM 1996 Views
She thinks both - 18/07/2011 12:22:59 AM 1926 Views
So... - 17/07/2011 07:18:24 PM 1949 Views
No, it's him. - 18/07/2011 12:25:33 AM 1937 Views
Is there any hot sex scenes? I won't be able to read it for a while *NM* - 13/07/2011 02:35:49 PM 1169 Views
One or two, but not all that long ones *NM* - 13/07/2011 02:57:12 PM 1122 Views
Great Ending - 14/07/2011 01:21:53 AM 2226 Views
Really? - 14/07/2011 09:36:01 AM 2160 Views
Re: Really? - 14/07/2011 09:38:34 AM 1802 Views
Re: Great Ending - 18/07/2011 02:05:00 AM 1954 Views
YES! - 14/07/2011 02:38:48 AM 1795 Views
Sorry for the n00b reply, sentiments still apply - 16/07/2011 07:27:43 PM 1947 Views
Re: Sorry for the n00b reply, sentiments still apply - 17/07/2011 12:45:52 AM 1925 Views
I don't know what to think... (spoiler) - 14/07/2011 08:59:39 AM 2147 Views
Probably not. - 14/07/2011 09:19:03 AM 2135 Views
Re: Probably not. - 14/07/2011 03:57:55 PM 1970 Views
I think the two are mixed up. - 14/07/2011 11:23:06 PM 2049 Views
Re: I think the two are mixed up. - 18/07/2011 02:10:29 AM 1891 Views
What made least sense for me as far as that is concerned... - 14/07/2011 11:51:20 AM 2030 Views
They didn't. - 14/07/2011 11:24:53 PM 2062 Views
I see - 15/07/2011 08:28:09 AM 1982 Views
Didn't Jon just announced - 26/07/2011 02:51:07 AM 1940 Views
Something I totally missed first time through - 14/07/2011 09:40:33 AM 2342 Views
Re: Something I totally missed first time through - 16/07/2011 01:24:23 AM 2258 Views
Yep, that's what he said/thought - 17/07/2011 05:02:32 AM 2074 Views
Re: Something I totally missed first time through - 23/07/2011 04:14:38 PM 1924 Views
Well that brings new meaning - 26/07/2011 02:53:18 AM 1842 Views
I'm still not fully done, but about the Reek chapters... - 14/07/2011 04:05:29 PM 2060 Views
Agreed - 14/07/2011 06:18:15 PM 2081 Views
There's another... - 14/07/2011 07:16:11 PM 1892 Views
There's that... - 17/07/2011 01:12:33 AM 1945 Views
It's worse than that... - 17/07/2011 01:26:50 AM 1967 Views
Torture is wrong, and those chapters kinda proved it. *NM* - 26/07/2011 02:53:55 AM 1072 Views
Having finished the book, my thoughts. (Spoilers) - 16/07/2011 08:11:30 AM 2069 Views
Re: Having finished the book, my thoughts. (Spoilers) - 17/07/2011 01:02:10 AM 2013 Views
You put words to my thoughts exactly. - 18/08/2011 09:17:09 PM 1920 Views
It should be re-titled A Jump with Sharks - 17/07/2011 06:00:37 PM 2138 Views
Publishers are more interested in the bottom line. - 18/07/2011 12:31:56 AM 1906 Views
Sadly, I am likely overestimating the intelligence of the readers. - 18/07/2011 03:05:12 AM 2124 Views
I felt bummed by Sanderson's new series. - 18/07/2011 05:25:09 AM 1976 Views
I bought that book but have yet to read it. - 18/07/2011 01:09:15 PM 1927 Views
Re: I bought that book but have yet to read it. - 20/07/2011 06:45:46 AM 1934 Views
You might like this quote from House of Leaves by Mark Z Danielewski. - 11/08/2011 03:42:05 PM 2028 Views
I'm afraid I have to agree with what seems to be the majority opinion... - 17/07/2011 07:35:47 PM 2061 Views
And on a different note entirely: is it me, or did the book need more proofreading? - 17/07/2011 07:39:15 PM 1949 Views
Yeah, I agree. - 18/07/2011 05:59:58 PM 1998 Views
The book really shows it is AFFC part 2 - 26/07/2011 03:00:07 AM 1971 Views
Am I The Only One In Love With Arya's Chapters? *spoilers maybe* - 18/07/2011 02:22:00 AM 1982 Views
I enjoyed them, very solid chapters. - 18/07/2011 12:50:43 PM 2020 Views
Unlike others, I won't start a separate thread to express my thoughts - 19/07/2011 11:21:17 AM 2132 Views
Yeah, I wished there was a way to move them in here! - 19/07/2011 01:42:51 PM 1889 Views
Me too... but going and complaining about them seems so lame, too. - 19/07/2011 07:34:47 PM 1892 Views
I agree with Jens, good balanced review. *NM* - 19/07/2011 07:50:13 PM 1057 Views
I think you let him off too easily. - 20/07/2011 04:19:07 AM 2024 Views
Your review is a little too generous (in my opinion) - 20/07/2011 06:57:45 AM 2192 Views
I find myself both depressed and let down... - 20/07/2011 06:37:16 AM 2313 Views
Am I the only one who really likes... - 20/07/2011 06:04:00 PM 2134 Views
yeh, he is nice... *NM* - 20/07/2011 06:20:13 PM 1050 Views
Davos is probably my favourite - 20/07/2011 09:51:03 PM 1791 Views
I have to disagree in regards to Penny, she's a plot device and an annoying one at that. - 21/07/2011 01:15:33 AM 2106 Views
The six bodies fired by the trebuchet - 20/07/2011 10:36:16 PM 1983 Views
Yes, I was confused by that too. - 20/07/2011 10:53:35 PM 1908 Views
Probably pale mare victims. Seige warfare via plague - 20/07/2011 11:23:10 PM 1963 Views
Yes, I considered that as well... - 20/07/2011 11:48:32 PM 1915 Views
Have Quentyn's two mates already been sent off a this point? - 21/07/2011 02:03:15 PM 1973 Views
That could be it. *NM* - 21/07/2011 01:43:16 PM 967 Views
Stannis - 21/07/2011 08:43:40 AM 1934 Views
It's entirely possible Stannis was killed - 21/07/2011 02:09:10 PM 2011 Views
I highly doubt he's dead - 21/07/2011 07:29:59 PM 1967 Views
The bluff makes the most sense: if the Boltons beat Stannis, why does he ask for Theon & Jeyne? - 22/07/2011 12:01:30 AM 2030 Views
Yeah... - 22/07/2011 12:27:53 AM 1930 Views
The Aegon Twist. Something about this doesn't add up. - 21/07/2011 10:43:43 PM 2007 Views
Re: The Aegon Twist. Something about this doesn't add up. - 22/07/2011 05:42:13 PM 2103 Views
Alternatively.. - 22/07/2011 09:13:46 PM 1944 Views
Which gods do you think are "real" in Martin's world? - 22/07/2011 04:32:39 PM 1989 Views
None of them. - 22/07/2011 06:25:19 PM 1882 Views
Is that personal opinion or based on something Martin said? *NM* - 22/07/2011 06:37:57 PM 1059 Views
Opinion - 22/07/2011 07:43:16 PM 1925 Views
I think there are some god's, just given different names. Same with the magic. - 22/07/2011 09:24:51 PM 1920 Views
Lose the apostrophe in the subject line. Then: on what basis do you assume this? - 23/07/2011 02:28:49 AM 1948 Views
You might want to stop wasting time correcting others typos. As for the gods... - 23/07/2011 04:53:59 AM 1834 Views
You might want to stop making them. Particularly glaring ones like that. - 23/07/2011 05:01:03 AM 2002 Views
A typo can't be "glaring"... - 23/07/2011 08:08:51 AM 1887 Views
Sure it can. Glaring: conspicuous or obvious. - 23/07/2011 03:52:57 PM 1899 Views
Morality stems from god? - 22/07/2011 10:47:59 PM 1899 Views
Of course it does - 23/07/2011 02:26:50 AM 1875 Views
On second thought, let's address the issue directly. - 23/07/2011 05:14:59 AM 1974 Views
Perhaps... - 24/07/2011 07:03:24 PM 1920 Views
Its simple... - 24/07/2011 07:37:11 PM 1924 Views
I disagree... - 25/07/2011 04:10:04 AM 1982 Views
Bullshit. - 25/07/2011 05:44:41 AM 1861 Views
Re: Bullshit. - 25/07/2011 06:27:09 AM 1769 Views
Some thoughts... - 25/07/2011 04:54:05 AM 1879 Views
It's not an objective morality. - 25/07/2011 05:41:33 AM 1874 Views
Its not that simple... - 25/07/2011 06:21:39 AM 1931 Views
I don't disagree with most of what you said. I just reach a different conclusion. - 25/07/2011 01:57:31 PM 1860 Views
Well... - 25/07/2011 05:02:45 PM 1881 Views
How then do you deal with the Euthyphro dilemma? - 16/08/2011 01:43:18 PM 1745 Views
Re: Which gods do you think are "real" in Martin's world? - 25/07/2011 02:24:07 PM 1805 Views
Whats the best new POV - 26/07/2011 03:14:05 AM 1927 Views
Barristan - 26/07/2011 12:23:20 PM 1891 Views
Didn't Aeron "Damphair" Greyjoy also only have 2 POVs - 26/07/2011 03:56:57 PM 1969 Views
Agreed. *NM* - 26/07/2011 11:33:11 PM 1092 Views
thirded. - 27/07/2011 04:16:26 PM 1767 Views
Absolutely *NM* - 29/07/2011 02:31:54 AM 1180 Views
Things you missed till they were pointed out via others or via a reread - 26/07/2011 03:23:53 AM 2072 Views
A bit. - 26/07/2011 12:32:32 PM 2039 Views
- 26/07/2011 03:46:54 PM 1984 Views
Re: - 27/07/2011 12:43:43 AM 1920 Views
Martin doesn't have to do anything - 27/07/2011 01:33:36 AM 2004 Views
Re: Martin doesn't have to do anything - 27/07/2011 04:38:19 AM 1878 Views
Re: Martin doesn't have to do anything - 27/07/2011 08:58:55 AM 1802 Views
Re: - 27/07/2011 04:27:18 AM 1987 Views
I like your theory. - 27/07/2011 04:35:22 PM 2002 Views
Interesting... hadn't noticed some of those either. - 26/07/2011 11:32:18 PM 1999 Views
Re: Interesting... hadn't noticed some of those either. - 27/07/2011 02:00:42 AM 1890 Views
Eh? - 29/07/2011 04:44:17 PM 2003 Views
This is complicated. - 31/07/2011 10:43:15 PM 2206 Views
Wait...a woman crowned for beauty was the victorious mystery knight? - 01/08/2011 03:00:49 AM 1902 Views
It is believed the Knight of the Laughing Tree is one of two people - 01/08/2011 04:47:21 AM 1949 Views
Yup. - 02/08/2011 12:03:26 AM 1841 Views
Also... - 02/08/2011 07:17:43 AM 1944 Views
And yet, my huge brain figures it out - 04/08/2011 04:20:06 PM 1915 Views
I've read this scene yesterday and I missed this... - 02/08/2011 07:55:35 AM 1936 Views
Allow me - 05/08/2011 02:14:15 PM 1789 Views
thanks *NM* - 07/08/2011 07:28:21 AM 1044 Views
I thought this was pretty clear - 07/08/2011 05:18:54 PM 1819 Views
Hizdahr a Harpy? Innocent or Not? - 26/07/2011 03:36:56 AM 2212 Views
Interesting idea. - 26/07/2011 12:25:11 PM 2018 Views
Re: Interesting idea. - 27/07/2011 04:25:02 PM 1940 Views
What is happening with the Maesters subplot? Any new leads? - 26/07/2011 04:13:27 PM 1930 Views
Re: What is happening with the Maesters subplot? Any new leads? - 27/07/2011 12:49:52 AM 2137 Views
Re: What is happening with the Maesters subplot? Any new leads? - 27/07/2011 03:49:18 AM 2039 Views
Re: A Dance with Dragons discussion thread - 29/07/2011 01:42:57 AM 2123 Views
Okay. I suck. - 29/07/2011 01:50:56 AM 1861 Views
Let me rephrase that... - 29/07/2011 01:54:07 AM 1837 Views
Jon Snow is definitely Azor Ahai. - 29/07/2011 07:31:17 PM 2443 Views
Hmm - 31/07/2011 01:52:03 PM 2366 Views
you are correct - 31/07/2011 11:08:39 PM 1938 Views
Yup. - 31/07/2011 10:49:34 PM 1755 Views
But Shireen is a dragon... - 01/08/2011 12:22:16 AM 1950 Views
I'm uncertain about that - 01/08/2011 05:35:18 AM 1920 Views
True, but I wouldn't read too much into that. - 01/08/2011 11:42:29 PM 2185 Views
Where did he say that? - 02/08/2011 07:18:39 AM 2064 Views
In interviews - 02/08/2011 02:21:28 PM 2017 Views
A little thought about Jon... - 02/08/2011 08:02:34 AM 2083 Views
Excellent point. - 02/08/2011 02:22:22 PM 2003 Views
Am I the only one who thinks... - 09/08/2011 05:16:46 PM 2032 Views
I think Martin's gonna stick to Bran being the only one who does that - 10/08/2011 09:25:12 AM 2090 Views
Anyone have any thoughts as to the purpose of Arya's storyline? - 14/08/2011 06:28:09 PM 1941 Views
She's being trained as an assassin, so the question is who is she going to kill? - 16/08/2011 01:43:12 AM 1873 Views
Jon? - 18/08/2011 09:59:03 PM 1913 Views

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