Interesting way of dismissing what has already been discussed about the book
Larry Send a noteboard - 03/02/2010 04:22:26 AM
The discussion hasn't started yet, probably because those not wearing pink cardigans felt they might be out of place.
Didn't realize that my comments on the form and structure of the novel, brief as I kept them in my original post, constituted little to nothing in the discussion that occurred...
Illusions fall like the husk of a fruit, one after another, and the fruit is experience. - Narrator, Sylvie
Je suis méchant.
Je suis méchant.
The Count of Monte Cristo by Alexandre Dumas - Book Club now open!
- 25/01/2010 10:54:37 PM
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Les characters.
- 25/01/2010 10:56:23 PM
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Why does the book have enduring appeal?
- 25/01/2010 10:57:37 PM
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Or rather, does this book share any traits in common with pornography?
- 25/01/2010 11:14:01 PM
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I think the revenge plot is actually fairly weak.
- 26/01/2010 03:43:04 AM
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Re: I think the revenge plot is actually fairly weak.
- 26/01/2010 11:12:19 AM
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In that case, the "release" is quite unsatisfying.
- 27/01/2010 01:42:28 PM
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Which is precisely part of what makes the book interesting
- 27/01/2010 02:06:58 PM
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He would not have known the book would be ruined by water. He thought he was being buried.
- 27/01/2010 02:15:02 PM
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Oh, and your point on revenge - that's just reading too much into the text.
- 27/01/2010 02:16:05 PM
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There is no such thing
- 27/01/2010 02:18:46 PM
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I fundamentally disagree with your post-modern take on the novel.
- 27/01/2010 02:25:25 PM
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Re: Which is precisely part of what makes the book interesting
- 27/01/2010 03:40:36 PM
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Maybe it's of the same importance as the Lost Symbol.
- 27/01/2010 03:44:55 PM
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I think one important question to ask is...
- 26/01/2010 12:00:17 AM
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I like it, but it is purely on the adventure story level, and I've read the unabridged version.
- 26/01/2010 12:03:01 AM
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I'm fairly certain I read the unabridged version. It was 1500 pages. *NM*
- 26/01/2010 02:36:10 AM
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I have read the abridged version a couple of times. I am reading the unabridged version this time.
- 26/01/2010 03:25:50 AM
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I have read both
- 27/01/2010 01:37:00 AM
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I actually didn't mean the people here on the site so much as readers in general.
- 27/01/2010 01:44:46 AM
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Re: I actually didn't mean the people here on the site so much as readers in general.
- 27/01/2010 01:48:11 AM
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Re: I got here too late, so I offer Umberto Eco's thoughts on the matter:
- 22/02/2010 06:59:13 PM
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The book was very childish.
- 26/01/2010 03:05:01 AM
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Granted, The Master and Margarita is also very much a fantasy book. *NM*
- 26/01/2010 03:07:45 AM
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No, it really isn't.
- 26/01/2010 03:10:08 AM
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You know, this is a problem.
- 26/01/2010 03:43:14 AM
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Thank God, I've never even heard of "Skol". Popov, yes, but Skol?
- 26/01/2010 03:49:08 AM
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I've not tried it, but every time I go into liquor stores, it sits on the bottom shelf.
- 26/01/2010 03:57:03 AM
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There's really nothing I can say to this that Greg didn't just say above.
- 26/01/2010 06:32:02 AM
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Re: No, it really isn't.
- 26/01/2010 10:57:19 AM
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Having Camilla concur with me on literary matters is very encouraging. 
- 26/01/2010 01:37:23 PM
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- 26/01/2010 01:37:23 PM
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I do not agree with your complete dismissal of The Count of Monte Cristo, though
- 26/01/2010 04:58:58 PM
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You make some rather odd claims here, Tom
- 27/01/2010 12:43:41 AM
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My claims are far from odd. In fact, they're quite common.
- 27/01/2010 01:57:41 AM
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In some circles; in others, they're rather antiquated nowadays
- 27/01/2010 02:21:03 AM
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If you were trying to write literature, wouldn't the label sting for you?
- 27/01/2010 01:25:14 PM
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I think it's easier to think of stories fitting into genre(s) than to think the same of authors
- 27/01/2010 02:40:29 PM
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Allow me to clarify: I'm talking about authors' reactions to their books being so labelled.
- 27/01/2010 03:08:47 PM
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But yet their reactions vary widely
- 27/01/2010 11:33:25 PM
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My fundamental premise is that genre has the most utility when applied to derivative fiction.
- 28/01/2010 09:39:17 PM
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And yet that term is mostly used as a non-loaded term that doesn't attempt to ascribe quality levels
- 29/01/2010 02:49:20 AM
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I like my definition of science fiction better than the one you quoted.
- 29/01/2010 05:16:36 AM
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I think estrangement is a key element, though
- 30/01/2010 11:00:19 PM
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I don't think estrangement is a necessary element.
- 30/01/2010 11:47:07 PM
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I mean it as a literary effect, that of creating a distance between text and reader
- 31/01/2010 12:03:34 AM
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Even if that's the meaning, I still disagree.
- 03/02/2010 12:49:58 AM
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Depends on how you view SF, I suppose
- 03/02/2010 04:20:56 AM
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I thought that was what we were mulling over
- 03/02/2010 04:38:35 AM
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Your unscientific anecdotal evidence sounds very odd to me.
- 28/01/2010 12:15:10 AM
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It might. I'm not purporting to speak for all of humanity (at least on this point). 
- 28/01/2010 09:43:40 PM
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- 28/01/2010 09:43:40 PM
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approve of this message.
So, what you're saying is that watching the 2002 movie was sufficient? Good! *NM*
- 26/01/2010 06:34:53 AM
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*NM*
- 26/01/2010 06:34:53 AM
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I'm not through it quite yet, but I do have a question
- 26/01/2010 12:24:14 PM
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Wait...you VOTED for this book?
- 26/01/2010 01:41:00 PM
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I honestly can't remember.
- 26/01/2010 01:55:39 PM
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Doctor Zhivago is one of the best novels ever written.
- 26/01/2010 02:12:35 PM
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Right, so now we all know that if we'd just listen to me more often, the world would be better.
- 26/01/2010 02:20:56 PM
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The problem was that the suggestions were generally not that good.
- 26/01/2010 02:32:50 PM
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You really are ignornant of what A.S. Byatt writes, aren't you?
- 27/01/2010 12:51:00 AM
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- 27/01/2010 12:51:00 AM
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Oh, I fucking hate epistolary novels. Thank you for warning me.
- 27/01/2010 02:00:34 AM
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It's funny because I think it's a question of taste level.
- 26/01/2010 02:32:08 PM
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Curious George is a tale of many layers, as told by Werner Herzog
- 26/01/2010 02:34:27 PM
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On what basis?
- 26/01/2010 02:51:40 PM
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It's a children's book. Get over it. Democracy failed.
- 26/01/2010 02:55:03 PM
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Usually does, when those who know better keep silent.
- 26/01/2010 02:57:54 PM
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Regarding comfort zones
- 26/01/2010 05:08:50 PM
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Camilla, let's be honest here...
- 26/01/2010 05:40:08 PM
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Re: Camilla, let's be honest here...
- 26/01/2010 09:10:47 PM
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If that's your goal, Camilla, you failed.
- 27/01/2010 01:35:52 PM
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Possibly
- 27/01/2010 01:38:39 PM
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I have not been ranting and raving. I've been highly critical of the book, with much justification.
- 27/01/2010 01:45:05 PM
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Re: I've been highly critical of the book, with much justification.
- 27/01/2010 01:53:28 PM
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I was wondering how long it would take for you to blame me and Greg.
- 27/01/2010 02:26:12 PM
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Don't you get it? We bring this place down.
- 27/01/2010 02:42:32 PM
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Heh heh heh. Pink cardigan-wearing suburban cul-de-sac. I like it. *NM*
- 27/01/2010 03:11:25 PM
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*NM*
- 27/01/2010 03:11:25 PM
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Re: I was wondering how long it would take for you to blame me and Greg.
- 27/01/2010 02:43:11 PM
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While that was not the intent, that is an added bonus.
- 27/01/2010 02:48:47 PM
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why is it a bonus?
- 27/01/2010 02:52:58 PM
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I said see above. You should have before the thought police, Rebekah, started to delete.
- 27/01/2010 02:59:07 PM
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Well, you wouldn't grow tired of us calling a novel shit if you chose a novel that wasn't shit.
- 27/01/2010 03:11:57 PM
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Re: Regarding comfort zones
- 27/01/2010 11:57:03 AM
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So. I really liked it.
- 26/01/2010 08:57:02 AM
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Yes, fearless leader, this is where I stand.
- 26/01/2010 11:04:23 PM
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Re: Yes, fearless leader, this is where I stand.
- 26/01/2010 11:49:03 PM
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We were talking about this last night.
- 27/01/2010 11:14:21 AM
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Re: We were talking about this last night.
- 27/01/2010 11:37:04 AM
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If you do that, I'm posting on the deeper meaning of Dan Brown.
- 27/01/2010 01:46:35 PM
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Feel free to.
- 27/01/2010 01:51:23 PM
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Your post-modern take on the novel is shit, shit, shit.
- 27/01/2010 02:28:56 PM
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Re: Your post-modern take on the novel is shit, shit, shit.
- 27/01/2010 02:45:41 PM
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I'm not setting up a straw man. I'm challenging your touchy-feely approach.
- 27/01/2010 03:15:00 PM
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My touchy-feely approach?
- 27/01/2010 05:09:04 PM
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Yes...using passing references in the text to justify a deeper analysis.
- 27/01/2010 05:16:10 PM
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Doesn't touchy-feely mean that it is steeped in or based on emotion?
- 27/01/2010 06:40:31 PM
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I think between the two of you I agree more with Tom here.
- 27/01/2010 07:01:08 PM
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Re: I think between the two of you I agree more with Tom here.
- 27/01/2010 08:29:32 PM
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See my reply to Tom for clarification, then.
- 27/01/2010 08:57:18 PM
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Re: See my reply to Tom for clarification, then.
- 27/01/2010 09:09:47 PM
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Er. Whose position are you arguing - mine or yours?
- 27/01/2010 10:33:01 PM
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- 27/01/2010 10:33:01 PM
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Mine. Which is more complicated than a simple rejection. That is what I am saying.
- 01/02/2010 12:53:58 PM
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Do it. I'd read that.
- 27/01/2010 01:55:23 PM
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All righty, that's enough of that. For Tom, Greg, and... no, pretty much just you two.
- 27/01/2010 04:33:00 PM
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I call bullshit. I have been conducting the debate in a measured fashion.
- 27/01/2010 04:50:35 PM
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And ANOTHER THING
- 27/01/2010 05:05:17 PM
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Not everyone has finished reading it yet *NM*
- 27/01/2010 05:12:10 PM
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Okay, so you'll get one or two stragglers in a week to a month. It changes nothing.
- 27/01/2010 05:17:51 PM
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Re: Okay, so you'll get one or two stragglers in a week to a month. It changes nothing.
- 27/01/2010 06:41:11 PM
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We are discussing this book. We're discussing its faults.
- 27/01/2010 07:30:49 PM
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In the interest of discussing Dumas' intentions...
- 27/01/2010 08:03:24 PM
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Re: We are discussing this book. We're discussing its faults.
- 27/01/2010 08:30:19 PM
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The text doesn't warrant "close attention" any more than Dan Brown's works do.
- 27/01/2010 09:10:45 PM
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Also, do you think a good book would have generated this level of discussion? Of course not.
- 27/01/2010 05:21:45 PM
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What discussion?
- 27/01/2010 06:42:32 PM
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I said that we couldn't discuss the book on its own terms.
- 27/01/2010 07:35:32 PM
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Which I still think we can.
- 27/01/2010 08:35:35 PM
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Perhaps you shouldn't be breaking things down at all.
- 27/01/2010 09:06:59 PM
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Re: Perhaps you shouldn't be breaking things down at all.
- 27/01/2010 09:12:22 PM
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I apologize if I'm part of the reason you feel ganged up on.
- 27/01/2010 10:40:36 PM
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Re: I apologize if I'm part of the reason you feel ganged up on.
- 01/02/2010 12:56:03 PM
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Deary me.
- 27/01/2010 05:19:58 PM
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By "respect" do you mean that you want me to drop my debates?
- 27/01/2010 05:24:03 PM
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Not at all.
- 27/01/2010 05:35:34 PM
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I'm sorry as well - if I had any kind of willpower, it wouldn't have gotten that far.
- 27/01/2010 06:29:43 PM
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On the nature of the "Book Club"
- 28/01/2010 09:23:23 PM
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Any chance of seeing some shorter suggestions?
- 28/01/2010 10:20:59 PM
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Yes, shorter would be good.
- 28/01/2010 10:23:28 PM
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Well, you should have known better!
- 29/01/2010 01:29:40 AM
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- 29/01/2010 01:29:40 AM
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All I can say is The Master and Margarita better be one by March. WE WAS ROBBED. *NM*
- 29/01/2010 02:31:48 AM
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*NM*
- 29/01/2010 02:31:48 AM
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Well I'm late to the party
- 29/01/2010 06:21:18 AM
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No, you're early
- 01/02/2010 01:26:10 PM
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I still have yet to see that discussion, Camilla. *NM*
- 03/02/2010 12:46:24 AM
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Interesting way of dismissing what has already been discussed about the book
- 03/02/2010 04:22:26 AM
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Nah, there's been discussion, here and there inbetween the fighting. *NM*
- 03/02/2010 04:39:24 PM
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*NM*
- 03/02/2010 04:39:24 PM
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An interesting quote from the book - does it jibe with your experience?
- 29/01/2010 11:23:54 PM
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