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Re: No I'm not. aerocontrols Send a noteboard - 17/07/2017 02:55:54 PM

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I mean, okay, if you want to take my statement in a pretty obvious context and extrapolate into a universal principle, yes, we can discuss that,

I thought we could, but it appears we cannot. Why did you think I was doing anything else?


View original postIn any event, I still think you're wrong. There are plenty of various moral laws which everyone breaks-lying, for instance, or lust. Most people raised in a Christian culture believe these to be immoral acts, but virtually everyone engages in them. The fact that people believe these to be bad acts while engaging in them doesn't reveal any preference about the abolition of these moral imperatives; it reveals a general human difficulty in adhering to them.

Here is where we part ways, I guess. I think the true statement "Everyone lies" exposes the rule "Lying is wrong" as a gross oversimplification. The kind of rule we should stop believing in once we reach a level of maturity that can handle nuance. People lie all the time for the greater good and will continue to do so. Some lies do far more good than they will ever do harm.



View original postSo no, it's not that partisanship is blinding me to your argument--it's that your argument depends on an uncharitable interpretation on what I said and isn't even a very good principle in any case.



View original postEDIT: This came out grouchier than I intended, for which I apologize. I am irritated at the accusation of partisanship, which I think gets thrown about far too freely and is rarely a relevant talking point. Most of the people here are deeply partisan, but the fact that Tom is firmly on the other side of the aisle from me doesn't have any bearing on the merit of his arguments.

Well, I apologize for upsetting you - that wasn't intended. I really did just want to discuss the principle and it appears you thought I was arguing for a side...?

As per your original question, I recall being asked on another site whether Snowden was a hero or a traitor and answering that he was probably both.

Hollywood has the best moral compass, because it has compassion.
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The truly amusing thing about all this. LiterateDog - 13/07/2017 02:32:33 PM 1202 Views
that's the thing with muddying the waters damookster - 13/07/2017 03:20:24 PM 588 Views
The media lost the respect they commanded back then. Tom - 13/07/2017 10:42:27 PM 491 Views
The other thing I was thinking.... Jeordam - 13/07/2017 07:05:27 PM 664 Views
We know how they would react because it happened. Tom - 13/07/2017 10:37:43 PM 553 Views
So imprison Clinton and Trump both. Just put Kasich in. I don't mind. Ghavrel - 14/07/2017 03:40:02 AM 579 Views
No thanks. We don't need Mr. Magoo as President. Tom - 14/07/2017 08:46:14 PM 613 Views
And why would we imprison Trump, counselor? Tom - 14/07/2017 08:47:34 PM 551 Views
This is your defense? "Other people would do it too?" *NM* Ghavrel - 14/07/2017 03:36:26 AM 276 Views
To quoque or not to quoque, I think the essential defense is there is NO wrongdoing in such events Cannoli - 14/07/2017 04:45:41 AM 627 Views
That's at least more logically consistent. Ghavrel - 14/07/2017 10:42:08 AM 664 Views
I don't need a defense.... Jeordam - 14/07/2017 08:31:12 PM 508 Views
Actually it is illegal in several ways Roland00 - 15/07/2017 01:55:02 AM 642 Views
dirt on an opponent is equivilent to a monetary disbursment? *NM* damookster - 15/07/2017 03:43:28 AM 393 Views
I don't have an opinion on whether the law was broken here. Ghavrel - 15/07/2017 05:12:08 AM 684 Views
Yes Roland00 - 15/07/2017 02:34:53 PM 563 Views
Bah damookster - 15/07/2017 04:56:08 PM 515 Views
Question Mookie, when did you think this law was enacted and last revised? Roland00 - 16/07/2017 11:46:43 AM 564 Views
No clue. I could google, of course, but that would be cheating. *NM* damookster - 16/07/2017 03:29:52 PM 319 Views
The offered dirty was that the Clintons were taking campaign donations from a foreign national again random thoughts - 18/07/2017 08:08:23 PM 548 Views
I very well could be wrong, but I don't think that I am. Jeordam - 17/07/2017 04:50:24 PM 568 Views
Well yeah. That happened. But it's not the main point. It's a side-bonus. nossy - 13/07/2017 10:22:32 PM 479 Views
I'm waiting for Little Marco to send me a subpoena. Tom - 13/07/2017 10:40:25 PM 587 Views
That's a very good point that needs further exploration damookster - 13/07/2017 11:54:56 PM 576 Views
The New York Times still has a fold? Tom - 14/07/2017 02:28:48 PM 527 Views
I think I served you a subpoena once. . . It was a small subpoena. *NM* Roland00 - 14/07/2017 09:02:48 AM 341 Views
What are your opinions on Manning and Snowden? I honestly don't remember. Ghavrel - 14/07/2017 03:42:09 AM 531 Views
Well, the Russian government did not swear oaths as members of the US military or public servants Cannoli - 14/07/2017 04:58:18 AM 632 Views
Extend the query to Wikileaks publishing the documents, then. Ghavrel - 14/07/2017 10:34:53 AM 603 Views
Are you sure? aerocontrols - 14/07/2017 02:29:51 PM 459 Views
That only works if you can claim with a straight face the GOP wouldn't care Ghavrel - 14/07/2017 03:32:43 PM 606 Views
You've misunderstood me aerocontrols - 14/07/2017 06:22:21 PM 605 Views
I don't think I have. Ghavrel - 15/07/2017 02:34:27 AM 545 Views
No I'm not. aerocontrols - 15/07/2017 03:09:04 AM 622 Views
Re: No I'm not. Ghavrel - 15/07/2017 05:07:42 AM 560 Views
Re: No I'm not. aerocontrols - 17/07/2017 02:55:54 PM 635 Views
Re: No I'm not. Ghavrel - 18/07/2017 01:27:06 AM 517 Views
Yes you are. Tom - 18/07/2017 06:40:45 AM 486 Views
You made the right choice, then. *NM* Ghavrel - 18/07/2017 03:37:40 PM 322 Views
It's really the only way I can get into cool threads aerocontrols - 18/07/2017 04:03:05 PM 498 Views
The Democrats definitely won in regards to changing the conversation. The Shrike - 14/07/2017 06:06:58 PM 617 Views
Pay no attention to that CIA agent behind the voting curtain (in X country) Tom - 18/07/2017 06:43:38 AM 599 Views
When the media is the cornerstone of your political base it is easy to control the tone random thoughts - 19/07/2017 01:22:51 PM 608 Views
The other amusing thing is the GOP voters' sudden love for Russia. Legolas - 14/07/2017 06:43:12 PM 636 Views
There was a great article in the NYT about that The Shrike - 14/07/2017 08:29:29 PM 719 Views
There's nothing "sudden" about it for me. *NM* Tom - 14/07/2017 08:49:38 PM 344 Views
I know. I was going to add a comment about how you must love that. Legolas - 14/07/2017 11:08:41 PM 1197 Views
I'm considering pitching to go on Fox or something. Tom - 18/07/2017 05:41:56 AM 544 Views
Murray Gell-Mann Amnesia aerocontrols - 18/07/2017 04:10:01 PM 746 Views
Good idea. Legolas - 23/07/2017 05:50:33 PM 591 Views
You are the fly in every republican cake Roland00 - 15/07/2017 01:56:24 AM 608 Views
I really don't understand 99% of your responses Tom - 18/07/2017 06:42:09 AM 627 Views
Yes Tom, Yes Exactly *NM* Roland00 - 18/07/2017 03:46:22 PM 328 Views
It was and still just the isolationist wing of the party that feels that way random thoughts - 19/07/2017 01:27:41 PM 563 Views
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