You truly are somehow oblivious to the entire point of one of the largest subplots in the entire series.
I don't know how to respond to that. I really don't.
Reread the entire Tower plot and check the number of references to politicking for control of either Halls, useless hierarchical crap like Shemerin's demotion, the outrage over stuff like Elaida disbanding the Blue Ajah, and contrast it to actually important stuff.
The entire purpose of the Tower split was that Aes Sedai cared more about their own squabbling than the end of the world. The three important points mentioned - Tarmon Gai'don, the Seanchan and the Black Tower are perfect examples that I am right!
Tarmon Gai'don: The division of the Tower has allowed Rand, the Dragon Reborn, to operate without always having to deal with Aes Sedai trying to control him. Because they are too busy squabbling over their position in the Aes Sedai hierarchy. You claim that Aes Sedai don't care about squabbling (because apparently you consider accusations of systemic support of world-breaking abominations, mass murderers and international criminals to be 'squabbling'
because Tarmon Gai'don is a greater priority, but the series actively proves you wrong. The Tower has been ignoring The Dragon and the Shadow because of their priority on squabbling! Heck, this is exactly why Aran'gar and Mesaana were working to maintain the split!
The Seanchan: Again, read The Gathering Storm. You will be surprised to find that in that book, the Tower is attacked by the Seanchan, and they are completely unprepared for it, because, guess what? They were dealing with more important things to them, namely infighting.
The Black Tower: The Rebels do absolutely nothing about the Black Tower, and Elaida sends one disastrous mission to pacify it. Aside from that, you have Tsutama Rath operating in secret to try to deal with the Black Tower because she considers it a greater priority than Tower squabbling. This would be great for your point, except that the reason she has to use secrecy in this is exactly because her priorities were not shared by the rest of the Tower!
Frankly, that you think that squabbling was not a priority for Aes Sedai is staggering. And that you apparently think that accusations of supporting False Dragons is 'squabbling' is also ridiculous. And that you insist that the Red Ajah doesn't care about this demonstrates disappointing wilful ignorance. I hate quoting Cannoli, but read the damn books, this is pretty explicitly refuted in The Extra Bit.
I don't know how to respond to that. I really don't.
Reread the entire Tower plot and check the number of references to politicking for control of either Halls, useless hierarchical crap like Shemerin's demotion, the outrage over stuff like Elaida disbanding the Blue Ajah, and contrast it to actually important stuff.
The entire purpose of the Tower split was that Aes Sedai cared more about their own squabbling than the end of the world. The three important points mentioned - Tarmon Gai'don, the Seanchan and the Black Tower are perfect examples that I am right!
Tarmon Gai'don: The division of the Tower has allowed Rand, the Dragon Reborn, to operate without always having to deal with Aes Sedai trying to control him. Because they are too busy squabbling over their position in the Aes Sedai hierarchy. You claim that Aes Sedai don't care about squabbling (because apparently you consider accusations of systemic support of world-breaking abominations, mass murderers and international criminals to be 'squabbling'
because Tarmon Gai'don is a greater priority, but the series actively proves you wrong. The Tower has been ignoring The Dragon and the Shadow because of their priority on squabbling! Heck, this is exactly why Aran'gar and Mesaana were working to maintain the split!The Seanchan: Again, read The Gathering Storm. You will be surprised to find that in that book, the Tower is attacked by the Seanchan, and they are completely unprepared for it, because, guess what? They were dealing with more important things to them, namely infighting.
The Black Tower: The Rebels do absolutely nothing about the Black Tower, and Elaida sends one disastrous mission to pacify it. Aside from that, you have Tsutama Rath operating in secret to try to deal with the Black Tower because she considers it a greater priority than Tower squabbling. This would be great for your point, except that the reason she has to use secrecy in this is exactly because her priorities were not shared by the rest of the Tower!
Frankly, that you think that squabbling was not a priority for Aes Sedai is staggering. And that you apparently think that accusations of supporting False Dragons is 'squabbling' is also ridiculous. And that you insist that the Red Ajah doesn't care about this demonstrates disappointing wilful ignorance. I hate quoting Cannoli, but read the damn books, this is pretty explicitly refuted in The Extra Bit.
Stop being hysterical and debate like an adult.
The rebellion against Elaida was not due to the lie, it was merely a falsehood Siuan later created and expanded upon to further her own cause to bring down her rival, and to gain the dubious support of the rebel Hall. You've encapsulated the entire White Tower split under this, which is blatantly untrue. Do you think you're dealing with unintelligent people, or do you seriously think I'm less aware of the series than you are?
We're talking about the present. You're going back to the earlier books and referring to those as part of your evidence of 'squabbling'. The split occured in book 4, and the attack on the Black Tower a few books later. The later books show the opinion of the Red Ajah on this - they find the lie scandalous but they're more concerned with the Black Tower (not invasion - but bonding) and the Dragon Reborn. Pevara and Tsutama openly speak about this.
I don't know why you've gone off on such a childish tangent about everything. You mentioned that it's about time the Reds mentioned the lie i.e. now that the Tower is reunified. I mentioned that the Reds are much more worried about other events that are taking place. Bringing up what happened six books ago makes no sense, and acting like I'm unfamiliar with the plot is extremely insulting.
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Character discussion 2 : Siuan Sanche and Leane Sharif
- 09/05/2010 06:01:33 PM
5537 Views
The "Shrinking of Siuan" after stilling destroyed my initial awe for the Amyrlin positition...
- 09/05/2010 07:07:09 PM
1409 Views
That's total nonsense...
- 10/05/2010 08:34:08 AM
1371 Views
No, THAT's total nonsense...
- 10/05/2010 09:27:41 AM
1262 Views
You seem to deal in bad analogies...
- 10/05/2010 05:14:47 PM
1257 Views
You've got an irritating manner about you. No wonder you find Aes Sedai so believable.
- 10/05/2010 05:53:00 PM
1122 Views
Hello Pot. I'm Kettle.
- 10/05/2010 06:41:58 PM
1135 Views
Hello Kettle. I'm Frying pan
*NM*
- 11/05/2010 03:43:20 PM
609 Views
*NM*
- 11/05/2010 03:43:20 PM
609 Views
Hello Frying pan. I'm Skillet. *NM*
- 12/05/2010 11:50:33 PM
627 Views
Re: Hello Skillet, I'm a baking sheet can't we all have some cookies and get along? *NM*
- 17/05/2010 05:17:24 PM
562 Views
All of those people EARNED their positions by being the best, not a compromise candidate for office!
- 12/05/2010 04:36:36 AM
1326 Views
Re: The "Shrinking of Siuan" after stilling destroyed my initial awe for the Amyrlin positition...
- 12/05/2010 04:23:07 AM
1263 Views
Re: The "Shrinking of Siuan" after stilling destroyed my initial awe for the Amyrlin positition...
- 12/05/2010 06:33:37 AM
1147 Views
They deserved to be deposed and stilled, I think ...
- 10/05/2010 02:47:35 PM
1283 Views
"They"?
- 10/05/2010 05:16:54 PM
1189 Views
Good point ...
- 10/05/2010 06:45:52 PM
1362 Views
I don't know if I agree with this
- 11/05/2010 03:19:20 PM
1252 Views
I like Leane, and respected Siuan until RJ mauled her character
- 10/05/2010 05:55:08 PM
1151 Views
She was probably the sacrificial lamb in place of Moiraine
- 10/05/2010 06:25:39 PM
1097 Views
The deck was certainly stacked against Siuan from the very beginning
- 11/05/2010 02:44:05 PM
1181 Views
This is a main reason I hope Siuan and Leanne get their full strength restored
- 11/05/2010 02:25:31 PM
1167 Views
I don't really agree
- 11/05/2010 05:35:44 PM
1138 Views
I see your point and like I said, I think there are certainly other resolutions to the story line
- 11/05/2010 06:22:44 PM
1130 Views
I'm still annoyed that Siuan is not going to face the consequences of lying about the Reds.
- 12/05/2010 05:18:47 AM
1199 Views
In Egwene's defense, it would be hypocritical of her to bring that up after profiting from it
- 12/05/2010 05:59:57 AM
1168 Views
Oh, I never expected Egwene to do something about this.
- 12/05/2010 06:12:35 AM
1056 Views
Well she's off forging a relationship with the Asha'man - you know, useful stuff? *NM*
- 12/05/2010 06:39:04 AM
672 Views
Are you claiming that Pevara was the only woman in the entire Red Ajah to be offended by that lie? *NM*
- 12/05/2010 07:15:40 AM
616 Views
The Reds aren't petty
- 12/05/2010 04:52:50 PM
1038 Views
Are you kidding?
- 12/05/2010 06:14:46 PM
1208 Views
Unless of course there is truth to it
- 17/05/2010 01:50:27 PM
1188 Views
There is none.
- 17/05/2010 07:09:59 PM
1170 Views
Uhhh?
- 17/05/2010 08:45:15 PM
1070 Views
...
- 17/05/2010 11:08:05 PM
1227 Views
Re: ...
- 18/05/2010 05:25:33 AM
1140 Views
Seriously, are you kidding? [EDIT]
- 18/05/2010 06:06:01 AM
1167 Views
*sigh*
- 18/05/2010 12:30:43 PM
1223 Views
So, you're not kidding.
- 18/05/2010 09:12:27 PM
1098 Views
Re: So, you're not kidding.
- 18/05/2010 10:25:19 PM
1121 Views
Re: So, you're not kidding.
- 19/05/2010 12:41:09 AM
1210 Views
On the minority thing...
- 18/05/2010 04:26:15 PM
1180 Views
That's exactly the problem.
- 18/05/2010 08:51:45 PM
1028 Views
Really do you have a quote supporting the fact that there has never been a FD supported by a Red?
- 18/05/2010 09:39:31 PM
1183 Views
Of course..., I'll provide it as soon as you prove you're not a Nazi serial child rapist.
- 18/05/2010 10:06:23 PM
989 Views
why so pissy?
- 19/05/2010 03:34:22 PM
1168 Views
Sorry.
- 20/05/2010 04:16:43 AM
1099 Views
Re: Sorry.
- 20/05/2010 08:19:13 AM
986 Views
Re: Sorry.
- 20/05/2010 08:33:54 AM
1247 Views
Re: Sorry.
- 20/05/2010 01:26:47 PM
1005 Views
Interesting.
- 20/05/2010 07:34:45 PM
1110 Views
Re: Interesting.
- 21/05/2010 05:07:07 AM
1114 Views
No worries! I was just caught off guard by your response... sorry for your stress! *NM*
- 20/05/2010 10:04:35 PM
703 Views
There may be one explanation...
- 13/05/2010 10:04:46 PM
1076 Views
That doesn't make sense.
- 13/05/2010 10:54:53 PM
1221 Views
it was about more than just male channelers
- 18/05/2010 09:50:14 PM
1285 Views
Yes, that's true.
- 18/05/2010 10:07:22 PM
1249 Views
I'm also certain the majority of the Red had no clue/involvement
- 20/05/2010 10:24:54 PM
1144 Views
That's also true.
- 20/05/2010 10:29:11 PM
1103 Views
Okay I'm leaving you alone ... you clearly don't want to continue
- 20/05/2010 10:31:01 PM
1097 Views
- 20/05/2010 10:31:01 PM
1097 Views
AS shrunk after stilling; Siuan and Leane became huge.
- 12/05/2010 10:50:50 PM
1107 Views
No, I don't think so
- 13/05/2010 05:10:03 AM
1032 Views
