By chance Nynaeve decided to further investigate the case concerning the dead messenger & Lady Chadmar on her own (contrary to Nynaeve, "Rand had determined that his hunt for the Domani king had hit a wall with the death of the messenger" ). Later, just before Nynaeve leaves the dungeon, she spontaneously decides to Delve Lady Chadmar to see, if she is ill and identifies the poison. This leads to Kerb, and Nynaeve manages to unravel the Compulsion on him (which is quite difficult). By chance or ta'veren, Kerb didn't lose his whole mind in the porcess, but does manage to utter at least the location of Graendal's palace, when he is asked by Rand.
While there certainly was some luck on Rand's side, this scene isn't that illogical. On the other hand, it's pretty crazy to think that Graendal could foresee all this, especially relying on chance, to lure Rand to her. If Graendal made a mistake, one could - in hindsight - say, it was apparently ordering the death of Lady Chadmar by this slow-working natural poison, which could be detected by a capable Wisdom AS in time (though as said, the Forsaken often make such mistakes, and it could have worked).
While there certainly was some luck on Rand's side, this scene isn't that illogical. On the other hand, it's pretty crazy to think that Graendal could foresee all this, especially relying on chance, to lure Rand to her. If Graendal made a mistake, one could - in hindsight - say, it was apparently ordering the death of Lady Chadmar by this slow-working natural poison, which could be detected by a capable Wisdom AS in time (though as said, the Forsaken often make such mistakes, and it could have worked).
It seems that some people think that Graendal is second only to the Creator in prowess. It was a complete coincidence that Nynaeve stumbled upon one of Graendal's victims. Not only that but Graendal would have had to assume that Rand could get her location from Kerb, which he was clearly forbidden to do. Rand had to get a female channeler to unravel Graendal's webs and then get a small piece of information before the boy died. If Graendal could plan this then she IS the Creator.
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Fan of Lanfear
Fan of Lanfear
Graendal's death would imply a major logical flaw in the story.
- 25/01/2010 05:18:23 PM
2854 Views
I think Graendal's death was a great scene
- 25/01/2010 05:26:51 PM
1590 Views
The scene itself was great. The rest is crap.
- 25/01/2010 05:37:44 PM
1397 Views
After reading 12 WoT books...
- 25/01/2010 05:46:31 PM
1487 Views
I think playing too many games just messes up with the integrety and solidness of the books ...
- 26/01/2010 09:46:16 PM
2881 Views
I agree and have my own additional notes as to why I don't think she is dead.
- 25/01/2010 06:18:30 PM
1439 Views
Re: I agree and have my own additional notes as to why I don't think she is dead.
- 25/01/2010 06:44:34 PM
1383 Views
well one of her major character parallels is Josef Mengel
- 25/01/2010 06:54:43 PM
1183 Views
Can you think of any way that would explain the Compulsion vanishing?
- 25/01/2010 07:52:40 PM
1209 Views
that's kind of my whole point
- 25/01/2010 08:43:19 PM
1143 Views
None of those "easy explanations" could work
- 26/01/2010 07:14:16 AM
1250 Views
my entire problem with the scene is that it just felt too open ended
- 26/01/2010 08:58:37 AM
1321 Views
Can't she knot it to disapate after being examined once?
- 26/01/2010 03:43:55 AM
1178 Views
Do we have evidence that this is possible?
- 26/01/2010 03:44:48 AM
1344 Views
Re: I agree and have my own additional notes as to why I don't think she is dead.
- 26/01/2010 02:03:51 AM
1373 Views
I'm glad you think Be'lal is alive.
- 26/01/2010 07:38:40 AM
1146 Views
- 26/01/2010 11:42:04 AM
1326 Views
Re: I'm glad you think Be'lal is alive.
- 26/01/2010 08:49:00 AM
1341 Views
Re: I'm glad you think Be'lal is alive.
- 26/01/2010 09:19:35 AM
1126 Views
Moiraine probably learned it while researching with Adealas and Vandene. *NM*
- 26/01/2010 04:57:09 PM
899 Views
- 26/01/2010 11:42:04 AM
1326 Views
He was balefired by a direct stream in front of at least two credible witnesses.
- 26/01/2010 04:10:13 PM
1340 Views
Re: I agree and have my own additional notes as to why I don't think she is dead.
- 25/01/2010 08:56:16 PM
1401 Views
I believe she's dead
- 25/01/2010 09:06:37 PM
1256 Views
Re: I believe she's dead
- 25/01/2010 09:09:58 PM
1293 Views
Besides, if it wasn't Graendal, it implies that she knew of Rand's plan, which is not feasible *NM*
- 26/01/2010 02:01:41 PM
693 Views
The compulsion did not disappear immediately. Read the damned scene!
- 25/01/2010 11:54:02 PM
1420 Views
Re: The compulsion did not disappear immediately. Read the damned scene!
- 26/01/2010 01:22:57 AM
1166 Views
Stop passing judgments...
- 26/01/2010 02:05:21 AM
1362 Views
But your theories are becoming increasingly farfetched
- 26/01/2010 04:21:21 AM
1238 Views
I repeat that I find her "death" monumental...
- 26/01/2010 07:16:13 PM
1219 Views
Re: I repeat that I find her "death" monumental...
- 26/01/2010 07:23:29 PM
1254 Views
Dude, then you derailed the thread...
- 26/01/2010 07:31:55 PM
1141 Views
no she said she wouldn't risk strength and skill in the same place
- 26/01/2010 08:51:31 AM
1185 Views
Re: no she said she wouldn't risk strength and skill in the same place
- 26/01/2010 11:37:26 AM
1338 Views
read the whole quote
- 26/01/2010 04:35:17 PM
984 Views
LOL! You read the whole quote
- 26/01/2010 07:00:41 PM
1118 Views
the risk she won't take is strength and skill residing together.
- 27/01/2010 12:40:09 AM
1183 Views
Re: the risk she won't take is strength and skill residing together.
- 28/01/2010 04:28:21 PM
1313 Views
I don't see any flaws.
- 25/01/2010 09:14:44 PM
1390 Views
But...
- 25/01/2010 11:44:49 PM
1125 Views
Re: But...
- 26/01/2010 01:14:51 AM
1291 Views
That still doesn't make sense.
- 26/01/2010 02:23:12 AM
1368 Views
But, having a clean up guy does make sense.
- 26/01/2010 03:02:13 AM
1374 Views
- 26/01/2010 03:02:13 AM
1374 Views
But the clean up guy would require another clean up guy!
- 26/01/2010 03:35:44 AM
1222 Views
Nonsense.
- 26/01/2010 07:50:04 AM
1101 Views
Dude, read what I said please...
- 26/01/2010 07:21:52 PM
1293 Views
Re: Dude, read what I said please...
- 26/01/2010 09:28:25 PM
1260 Views
Kerb had no initiative... he was under too heavy a Compulsion to think for himself
- 27/01/2010 12:45:47 AM
1146 Views
I think he had some, albeit probably not a whole lot
- 27/01/2010 01:03:44 AM
1207 Views
Messenger was running around being obvious. Noone would suspect Kerb though. Case Closed. *NM*
- 26/01/2010 11:08:16 AM
808 Views
Thank the creator you're not in the police then. *NM*
- 26/01/2010 07:22:29 PM
756 Views
Ok, in more detail:
- 26/01/2010 08:16:30 PM
1283 Views
Thoughts
- 26/01/2010 01:05:45 AM
1116 Views
Nope. Ramshalan was just "collecting taxes" or something.
- 26/01/2010 11:10:25 AM
1090 Views
Re: Nope. Ramshalan was NOT just "collecting taxes" or something.
- 26/01/2010 05:41:17 PM
1160 Views
By, the way, if I understand this correctly...
- 26/01/2010 04:49:45 PM
1363 Views
I'm not arguing she's alive, but...
- 26/01/2010 07:29:42 PM
1189 Views
Re: I'm not arguing she's alive, but...
- 26/01/2010 09:42:52 PM
976 Views
Re: I'm not arguing she's alive, but...
- 27/01/2010 03:26:46 AM
1208 Views
Re: I'm not arguing she's alive, but...
- 27/01/2010 04:05:23 AM
1299 Views
That's not fair
- 27/01/2010 04:09:38 AM
1148 Views
I agree about the 'awesome' part
.
- 27/01/2010 05:41:00 AM
1109 Views
.
- 27/01/2010 05:41:00 AM
1109 Views
Does anybody have a link to it? (nothing on Google). I'm intrigued. *NM*
- 27/01/2010 08:27:13 AM
705 Views
It was on Wotmania. Someone copied all the theories, but I don't recall whom. *NM*
- 27/01/2010 08:31:00 AM
830 Views
I just think it's funny that what you call omniscience has been done by the Forsaken before.
- 27/01/2010 02:02:44 PM
1117 Views
But Graendal was the victim of a greater plot.
- 27/01/2010 05:30:28 PM
1232 Views
So your response is that Ishamael/Moridin is omniscient, not Graendal.
- 27/01/2010 05:57:20 PM
1337 Views
Re: So your response is that Ishamael/Moridin is omniscient, not Graendal.
- 28/01/2010 04:05:21 AM
1305 Views
Give me one example. Just one. *NM*
- 27/01/2010 06:52:44 PM
773 Views
Ishamael plans millennia ahead by sowing the seeds for the Black Ajah, the Seanchan and the current
- 28/01/2010 01:57:39 PM
1288 Views
Not even comparable.
- 28/01/2010 06:31:06 PM
1050 Views
Re: Not even comparable.
- 28/01/2010 07:50:38 PM
1168 Views
Could you please take the effort to read my posts?
- 28/01/2010 10:45:01 PM
1130 Views
And, just to double post:
- 27/01/2010 07:12:17 PM
938 Views
Re: And, just to double post:
- 27/01/2010 08:25:45 PM
1254 Views
Nice answer.
- 28/01/2010 12:10:27 AM
1259 Views
Re: Nice answer.
- 28/01/2010 01:55:16 PM
1184 Views
Hilarious.
- 28/01/2010 06:36:22 PM
1301 Views
Re: Hilarious.
- 28/01/2010 07:15:20 PM
1197 Views
Re: Hilarious.
- 28/01/2010 07:41:29 PM
1214 Views
Re: Hilarious.
- 28/01/2010 07:53:34 PM
1058 Views
Re: Hilarious.
- 28/01/2010 10:55:57 PM
1241 Views
That's because you didn't look at other posts.
- 29/01/2010 03:37:08 PM
1178 Views
Moridin's main directive was..
- 29/01/2010 03:57:41 PM
1230 Views
Re: Moridin's main directive was..
- 29/01/2010 04:50:16 PM
1285 Views
Preventing order wasn't accomplished...
- 29/01/2010 05:12:22 PM
1239 Views
I disagree.
- 29/01/2010 05:28:59 PM
1598 Views
I will stop our discussion here; the posts are already pushed too far to the right of my display.
*NM*
- 29/01/2010 06:14:29 PM
628 Views
*NM*
- 29/01/2010 06:14:29 PM
628 Views
You expect me to search every post you've made on this forum, ever?
- 29/01/2010 06:50:49 PM
1166 Views
Re: I'm not arguing she's alive, but...
- 27/01/2010 01:00:42 AM
1174 Views
I don't see a flaw
- 27/01/2010 06:24:44 AM
1269 Views
Re: I don't see a flaw
- 27/01/2010 04:18:27 PM
1223 Views
Yup, I'm tired of seeing arguments that ignore the need to back up their own claims.
- 27/01/2010 05:47:16 PM
1204 Views
I don't think there's a flaw, I think you misinterpret Graendal's plans
- 27/01/2010 06:57:44 PM
1215 Views
Good point on Ituralde - he may still be Compulsed in ways we're yet to discover. *NM*
- 28/01/2010 04:11:15 AM
742 Views
Re: Graendal's death would imply a major logical flaw in the story.
- 27/01/2010 09:11:32 PM
1184 Views

*NM*