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Me, Too. The Name With No Man Send a noteboard - 28/01/2010 08:00:09 PM
We never saw his corpse and Shai'tan never confirmed his death. Therefore, he must be alive.

Be'lal can never die.
This message last edited by The Name With No Man on 28/01/2010 at 08:01:58 PM
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Graendal's death would imply a major logical flaw in the story. fionwe1987 - 25/01/2010 05:18:23 PM 2618 Views
I think Graendal's death was a great scene Etzel - 25/01/2010 05:26:51 PM 1311 Views
The scene itself was great. The rest is crap. fionwe1987 - 25/01/2010 05:37:44 PM 1085 Views
After reading 12 WoT books... Etzel - 25/01/2010 05:46:31 PM 1202 Views
You also ignored... randfandom - 25/01/2010 08:15:34 PM 1199 Views
and of course, the obvious theme Sidious - 25/01/2010 09:02:56 PM 989 Views
Bah! fionwe1987 - 25/01/2010 11:49:33 PM 1162 Views
It's possible that this was mainly written by BS Etzel - 26/01/2010 12:03:03 PM 1118 Views
I think playing too many games just messes up with the integrety and solidness of the books ... amirebram - 26/01/2010 09:46:16 PM 2564 Views
I agree that the set up for her death was rather lame darius_sedai - 25/01/2010 06:14:07 PM 1355 Views
I agree and have my own additional notes as to why I don't think she is dead. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 25/01/2010 06:18:30 PM 1147 Views
Re: I agree and have my own additional notes as to why I don't think she is dead. Underwood - 25/01/2010 06:44:34 PM 1100 Views
well one of her major character parallels is Josef Mengel darius_sedai - 25/01/2010 06:54:43 PM 893 Views
Can you think of any way that would explain the Compulsion vanishing? beetnemesis - 25/01/2010 07:52:40 PM 900 Views
that's kind of my whole point darius_sedai - 25/01/2010 08:43:19 PM 852 Views
Uh, not actually at all really Sidious - 25/01/2010 09:07:52 PM 1142 Views
*shudders* Yondaime - 26/01/2010 02:27:35 AM 1000 Views
*shrugs* darius_sedai - 26/01/2010 08:47:21 AM 1064 Views
None of those "easy explanations" could work beetnemesis - 26/01/2010 07:14:16 AM 945 Views
my entire problem with the scene is that it just felt too open ended darius_sedai - 26/01/2010 08:58:37 AM 1057 Views
Can't she knot it to disapate after being examined once? Rurouni_Kenshin - 26/01/2010 03:43:55 AM 875 Views
Do we have evidence that this is possible? Yondaime - 26/01/2010 03:44:48 AM 1038 Views
why would Graendal do that anyway? Sidious - 26/01/2010 04:26:38 AM 1047 Views
Re: why would Graendal do that anyway? Rurouni_Kenshin - 03/02/2010 02:52:32 AM 976 Views
Re: I agree and have my own additional notes as to why I don't think she is dead. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 26/01/2010 02:03:51 AM 1072 Views
I'm glad you think Be'lal is alive. Fanatic-Templar - 26/01/2010 07:38:40 AM 871 Views
Re: I'm glad you think Be'lal is alive. darius_sedai - 26/01/2010 08:49:00 AM 1032 Views
Re: I'm glad you think Be'lal is alive. Lord Haart - 26/01/2010 09:19:35 AM 842 Views
Moiraine probably learned it while researching with Adealas and Vandene. *NM* Gher - 26/01/2010 04:57:09 PM 740 Views
Sidious - 26/01/2010 11:42:04 AM 1054 Views
Didn't Balthamel and Aginor leave corpses? Fanatic-Templar - 26/01/2010 04:35:19 PM 1009 Views
Re: Didn't Balthamel and Aginor leave corpses? Sidious - 26/01/2010 07:06:01 PM 917 Views
Re: RugbyPlayingAshaman - 26/01/2010 04:44:06 PM 1009 Views
He was balefired by a direct stream in front of at least two credible witnesses. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 26/01/2010 04:10:13 PM 1014 Views
Me, Too. The Name With No Man - 28/01/2010 08:00:09 PM 982 Views
Re: I agree and have my own additional notes as to why I don't think she is dead. Sidious - 25/01/2010 08:56:16 PM 1113 Views
I believe she's dead Sareitha Sedai - 25/01/2010 09:06:37 PM 971 Views
Re: I believe she's dead Sidious - 25/01/2010 09:09:58 PM 1015 Views
I don't think she would have taught anyone Sareitha Sedai - 25/01/2010 09:18:03 PM 833 Views
Besides, if it wasn't Graendal, it implies that she knew of Rand's plan, which is not feasible *NM* Shannow - 26/01/2010 02:01:41 PM 548 Views
The compulsion did not disappear immediately. Read the damned scene! fionwe1987 - 25/01/2010 11:54:02 PM 1141 Views
Re: The compulsion did not disappear immediately. Read the damned scene! Underwood - 26/01/2010 01:22:57 AM 859 Views
Stop passing judgments... fionwe1987 - 26/01/2010 02:05:21 AM 1070 Views
But your theories are becoming increasingly farfetched Sidious - 26/01/2010 04:21:21 AM 955 Views
I repeat that I find her "death" monumental... fionwe1987 - 26/01/2010 07:16:13 PM 918 Views
Re: I repeat that I find her "death" monumental... Sidious - 26/01/2010 07:23:29 PM 964 Views
Dude, then you derailed the thread... fionwe1987 - 26/01/2010 07:31:55 PM 862 Views
Not really Sidious - 26/01/2010 07:35:06 PM 980 Views
Re: Not really fionwe1987 - 26/01/2010 07:45:20 PM 1018 Views
Re: Not really Sidious - 28/01/2010 04:27:17 PM 955 Views
Re: Stop passing judgments... RugbyPlayingAshaman - 26/01/2010 04:40:37 PM 952 Views
*NM* RugbyPlayingAshaman - 26/01/2010 05:00:10 PM 531 Views
Everyone can see residues- only a select few can "read" them beetnemesis - 26/01/2010 07:42:19 AM 983 Views
no she said she wouldn't risk strength and skill in the same place darius_sedai - 26/01/2010 08:51:31 AM 865 Views
Re: no she said she wouldn't risk strength and skill in the same place Sidious - 26/01/2010 11:37:26 AM 993 Views
read the whole quote darius_sedai - 26/01/2010 04:35:17 PM 728 Views
LOL! You read the whole quote Sidious - 26/01/2010 07:00:41 PM 847 Views
the risk she won't take is strength and skill residing together. darius_sedai - 27/01/2010 12:40:09 AM 891 Views
Re: the risk she won't take is strength and skill residing together. Sidious - 28/01/2010 04:28:21 PM 1063 Views
I don't see any flaws. Skeeve the Great - 25/01/2010 09:14:44 PM 1088 Views
But... fionwe1987 - 25/01/2010 11:44:49 PM 845 Views
Re: But... Skeeve the Great - 26/01/2010 01:14:51 AM 970 Views
That is what I thought ... Yondaime - 26/01/2010 01:24:18 AM 892 Views
That still doesn't make sense. fionwe1987 - 26/01/2010 02:23:12 AM 1052 Views
But, having a clean up guy does make sense. Yondaime - 26/01/2010 03:02:13 AM 1085 Views
But the clean up guy would require another clean up guy! fionwe1987 - 26/01/2010 03:35:44 AM 972 Views
Re: But the clean up guy would require another clean up guy! Yondaime - 26/01/2010 04:12:41 AM 894 Views
Nonsense. Fanatic-Templar - 26/01/2010 07:50:04 AM 821 Views
Dude, read what I said please... fionwe1987 - 26/01/2010 07:21:52 PM 984 Views
Re: Dude, read what I said please... Fanatic-Templar - 26/01/2010 09:28:25 PM 985 Views
Kerb had no initiative... he was under too heavy a Compulsion to think for himself darius_sedai - 27/01/2010 12:45:47 AM 886 Views
I think he had some, albeit probably not a whole lot Yondaime - 27/01/2010 01:03:44 AM 927 Views
Nynaeve and Elayne were under a weaker compulsion... fionwe1987 - 27/01/2010 03:10:52 AM 747 Views
We don't know that, exactly Yondaime - 27/01/2010 03:50:44 AM 801 Views
If you cannot provide an answer... fionwe1987 - 27/01/2010 03:10:40 AM 874 Views
Seriously? Fanatic-Templar - 27/01/2010 03:55:57 AM 928 Views
Maybe... Etzel - 27/01/2010 11:08:10 AM 859 Views
Messenger was running around being obvious. Noone would suspect Kerb though. Case Closed. *NM* Lord Haart - 26/01/2010 11:08:16 AM 675 Views
Thank the creator you're not in the police then. *NM* fionwe1987 - 26/01/2010 07:22:29 PM 605 Views
Ok, in more detail: Lord Haart - 26/01/2010 08:16:30 PM 1004 Views
I'm tired of making this point... fionwe1987 - 26/01/2010 08:39:22 PM 741 Views
Re: I'm tired of making this point... Syraelle - 26/01/2010 08:44:51 PM 908 Views
Thoughts Heiko - 26/01/2010 01:05:45 AM 847 Views
But that means she's dead Skeeve the Great - 26/01/2010 01:20:19 AM 912 Views
Re: But that means she's dead Heiko - 26/01/2010 05:31:25 AM 988 Views
Nope. Ramshalan was just "collecting taxes" or something. Lord Haart - 26/01/2010 11:10:25 AM 828 Views
Re: Nope. Ramshalan was NOT just "collecting taxes" or something. Syraelle - 26/01/2010 05:41:17 PM 925 Views
By, the way, if I understand this correctly... Fanatic-Templar - 26/01/2010 04:49:45 PM 1027 Views
Indeed... Etzel - 26/01/2010 05:13:53 PM 1065 Views
Re: Indeed... Sidious - 26/01/2010 07:04:40 PM 884 Views
I'm not arguing she's alive, but... fionwe1987 - 26/01/2010 07:29:42 PM 918 Views
Re: I'm not arguing she's alive, but... Underwood - 26/01/2010 07:58:41 PM 895 Views
Re: I'm not arguing she's alive, but... Fanatic-Templar - 26/01/2010 09:42:52 PM 712 Views
Re: I'm not arguing she's alive, but... fionwe1987 - 27/01/2010 03:26:46 AM 929 Views
Re: I'm not arguing she's alive, but... Fanatic-Templar - 27/01/2010 04:05:23 AM 997 Views
That's not fair Yondaime - 27/01/2010 04:09:38 AM 861 Views
I agree about the 'awesome' part . Fanatic-Templar - 27/01/2010 05:41:00 AM 828 Views
Does anybody have a link to it? (nothing on Google). I'm intrigued. *NM* Lord Haart - 27/01/2010 08:27:13 AM 562 Views
It was on Wotmania. Someone copied all the theories, but I don't recall whom. *NM* Fanatic-Templar - 27/01/2010 08:31:00 AM 702 Views
I just think it's funny that what you call omniscience has been done by the Forsaken before. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 27/01/2010 02:02:44 PM 813 Views
But Graendal was the victim of a greater plot. Lord Haart - 27/01/2010 05:30:28 PM 947 Views
So your response is that Ishamael/Moridin is omniscient, not Graendal. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 27/01/2010 05:57:20 PM 964 Views
Re: So your response is that Ishamael/Moridin is omniscient, not Graendal. Lord Haart - 28/01/2010 04:05:21 AM 996 Views
Give me one example. Just one. *NM* Fanatic-Templar - 27/01/2010 06:52:44 PM 629 Views
Ishamael plans millennia ahead by sowing the seeds for the Black Ajah, the Seanchan and the current RugbyPlayingAshaman - 28/01/2010 01:57:39 PM 983 Views
Not even comparable. Fanatic-Templar - 28/01/2010 06:31:06 PM 776 Views
Re: Not even comparable. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 28/01/2010 07:50:38 PM 901 Views
Could you please take the effort to read my posts? Fanatic-Templar - 28/01/2010 10:45:01 PM 829 Views
Re: Could you please take the effort to read my posts? RugbyPlayingAshaman - 29/01/2010 03:49:43 PM 889 Views
Re: Could you please take the effort to read my posts? Fanatic-Templar - 29/01/2010 06:40:43 PM 868 Views
And, just to double post: Fanatic-Templar - 27/01/2010 07:12:17 PM 651 Views
Re: And, just to double post: RugbyPlayingAshaman - 27/01/2010 08:25:45 PM 914 Views
Nice answer. Fanatic-Templar - 28/01/2010 12:10:27 AM 951 Views
Re: Nice answer. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 28/01/2010 01:55:16 PM 897 Views
Hilarious. Fanatic-Templar - 28/01/2010 06:36:22 PM 1006 Views
Re: Hilarious. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 28/01/2010 07:15:20 PM 935 Views
Re: Hilarious. Fanatic-Templar - 28/01/2010 07:41:29 PM 915 Views
Re: Hilarious. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 28/01/2010 07:53:34 PM 751 Views
Re: Hilarious. Fanatic-Templar - 28/01/2010 10:55:57 PM 949 Views
That's because you didn't look at other posts. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 29/01/2010 03:37:08 PM 902 Views
Moridin's main directive was.. Etzel - 29/01/2010 03:57:41 PM 903 Views
Re: Moridin's main directive was.. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 29/01/2010 04:50:16 PM 998 Views
Preventing order wasn't accomplished... Etzel - 29/01/2010 05:12:22 PM 952 Views
I disagree. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 29/01/2010 05:28:59 PM 1330 Views
I will stop our discussion here; the posts are already pushed too far to the right of my display. *NM* Etzel - 29/01/2010 06:14:29 PM 491 Views
You expect me to search every post you've made on this forum, ever? Fanatic-Templar - 29/01/2010 06:50:49 PM 874 Views
Re: I'm not arguing she's alive, but... Skeeve the Great - 27/01/2010 01:00:42 AM 885 Views
Re: I'm not arguing she's alive, but... fionwe1987 - 27/01/2010 03:26:56 AM 951 Views
Re: I'm not arguing she's alive, but... Skeeve the Great - 27/01/2010 05:35:39 AM 911 Views
I don't see a flaw rAndy aL - 27/01/2010 06:24:44 AM 1001 Views
Re: I don't see a flaw Underwood - 27/01/2010 04:18:27 PM 903 Views
Yup, I'm tired of seeing arguments that ignore the need to back up their own claims. Lord Haart - 27/01/2010 05:47:16 PM 896 Views
Let's give you one logic path for Millisair being poisoned. TheUltimateReality - 27/01/2010 05:47:04 PM 917 Views
Spot on. *NM* Lord Haart - 28/01/2010 04:09:26 AM 632 Views
I don't think there's a flaw, I think you misinterpret Graendal's plans DomA - 27/01/2010 06:57:44 PM 908 Views
Good point on Ituralde - he may still be Compulsed in ways we're yet to discover. *NM* Lord Haart - 28/01/2010 04:11:15 AM 612 Views
Compulsion is limited Sidious - 28/01/2010 04:30:24 PM 902 Views
Re: Compulsion is limited Lord Haart - 28/01/2010 06:35:05 PM 1028 Views
Re: Compulsion is limited DomA - 28/01/2010 08:26:37 PM 766 Views
Re: Graendal's death would imply a major logical flaw in the story. taura-tierno - 27/01/2010 09:11:32 PM 904 Views
There's really no further purpose for her character. Libby - 09/02/2010 10:52:58 PM 977 Views
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