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Everyone else is shown to be a bit small minded. Egwene is implied to be Strong And Wise beetnemesis Send a noteboard - 15/02/2010 09:23:47 PM

Which would make her as bad as everyone. Even the wretched Aiel only care about their remnant of a remnant, and every nation cares only about themselves with TG around the corner. Egwene is right to care only about the White Tower. When TG comes, she will fight behind Rand, but there is no reason for her to mobilize everyone to kneel before Rand at this stage.


The Wise Ones care about their remnant, but they're also thrown the support of all of the tribes to do whatever Rand commands.

It's perfectly fine to care about your own interests, as long as the interests of the Whole Wide World are put first! That's why the noblemen who constantly work behind Rand's back are scum, but why I don't loathe Cadsuane*


"Kneeling before Rand" is such a loaded comment, by the way. Rand is not trying to rule the world- he's trying to unite it before the Last Battle. A better analogy would be the Roman dictator Cincinatus, who became dictator for two years, fought off Rome's enemies, and then resigned the post.

Egwene SHOULD give the Tower's loyalty to Rand. All of this maneuvering, posturing, "Bargaining"- it pisses me off. He's the only one who can save the world. He needs every resource he can to do it. If everyone just shut the hell up for a year or two and fell in line, the world would be united, and he'd be a LOT less darker (No Elaida abduction to start the crazy, no wars filled with dead women to progress it, no failures against the Seancean to increase his frustration, no noblemen rebelling against him to make him even harder...)

I'm not saying they should be slaves, or worship him. Just freaking LISTEN to him. The Aiel clan chiefs are the best model of this- they do what he says, but they also meet with Rand, argue with him, offer advice, and say flat out there are some things they won't do. But they (mostly) obey him. He's their savior.



*Cadsuane is extremely irritating, and would love it if she had total control over Rand, but in the end she wants Rand to save the world and recognizes this is the most important thing. Note how she doesn't give a damn about the Tower civil war.



She's second only to Rand as a progressive character. She's the Amyrlin Seat and she reunited the warring White Tower, and purged the Black Ajah. Those are legendary feats. What more do you want?


I've gotten a bit off-topic. What do I want? I WANT Egwene- the character who is never wrong, the girl who can Do Anything, the one who has the respect of nearly every character in the series for her supposed Wisdom and Leadership abilities- to freaking live up to her reputation! I want her to go, "Great, I have the Tower. That's what the point of this was. Now I can work WITH Rand to save the world."


Instead, all I can picture when I think of likely meetings in the future will be statements like "You WILL respect the Amyrlin Seat" "How DARE you allow [women who attacked the Black Tower] to be taken captive"
I amuse myself.
This message last edited by beetnemesis on 15/02/2010 at 09:24:47 PM
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God I am so pissed off at Future Egwene beetnemesis - 14/02/2010 07:02:20 AM 2722 Views
My sentiments exactly, though I think I'm a little more hopeful than you are. Lord Haart - 14/02/2010 07:58:01 AM 1241 Views
Re: My sentiments exactly, though I think I'm a little more hopeful than you are. orius - 14/02/2010 09:26:47 AM 1047 Views
Just like Elayne treated him so well when she kicked him out of Andor? darius_sedai - 14/02/2010 01:35:32 PM 885 Views
What? We are no longer allowed to make predictions of the coming books unless they're pro-Egwene? Lordling - 14/02/2010 02:22:10 PM 991 Views
a theory vs. mindlessly attacking a character because you don't like them? darius_sedai - 14/02/2010 07:00:27 PM 974 Views
It IS kind of ridiculous... but how do YOU think a meeting will go? beetnemesis - 14/02/2010 07:20:08 PM 979 Views
We all do that darius_sedai - 14/02/2010 08:09:51 PM 1038 Views
Is Egwene going to do what Elayne did when she met Rand after tearing down his banners? Cannoli - 15/02/2010 11:25:27 AM 1150 Views
You just KNOW that rather than compliment all the good he's done.... Kronin al'Sulc - 14/02/2010 03:06:09 PM 835 Views
Personally, I'm rooting for Elaida's Foretelling to be fake Skeeve the Great - 14/02/2010 06:56:41 PM 1135 Views
I thought she DID say "This I Foretell?" beetnemesis - 14/02/2010 07:24:19 PM 966 Views
Yes she did. Skeeve the Great - 14/02/2010 07:34:43 PM 1174 Views
No way these are fake... she's not BA and she she says she's having a Foretelling darius_sedai - 14/02/2010 08:24:29 PM 1013 Views
Good point. And the "rent in fire and blood" part is almost certain as well. Lord Haart - 16/02/2010 05:13:29 PM 777 Views
Take a sedative Sidious - 14/02/2010 07:52:32 PM 1013 Views
somethings we can agree on! darius_sedai - 14/02/2010 08:12:05 PM 995 Views
None of the Emond's Fielders suck up to him. There's difference between hostile and 1-upping beetnemesis - 14/02/2010 09:01:35 PM 983 Views
Right cause Nynaeve is always going around telling people how much Mat's changed darius_sedai - 14/02/2010 09:27:02 PM 993 Views
If you'll recall what Mat did 5 minutes after... beetnemesis - 14/02/2010 11:06:41 PM 1015 Views
Not really darius_sedai - 14/02/2010 11:34:49 PM 906 Views
Re: Not really Gerbeaud - 15/02/2010 03:32:06 PM 915 Views
better than Nynaeve who just lies to herself in order to justify her actions! darius_sedai - 15/02/2010 05:53:17 PM 1027 Views
This is about Egwene, not Nynaeve. Lord Haart - 15/02/2010 06:09:46 PM 975 Views
actually it's about all of the main characters darius_sedai - 15/02/2010 06:13:27 PM 932 Views
Re: actually it's about all of the main characters Gerbeaud - 15/02/2010 06:39:25 PM 1026 Views
Well said. Lord Haart - 15/02/2010 07:20:47 PM 1046 Views
Re: Well said. Gerbeaud - 15/02/2010 07:43:08 PM 878 Views
yet even Siuan seems to understand and accept Egwene's response ... odd that you can hold her to darius_sedai - 16/02/2010 01:55:35 AM 812 Views
Oh, so Elaida's treatment of Sheremin is ok because Sheremin accepted it? Lord Haart - 16/02/2010 06:49:53 AM 973 Views
how is that a good comparrison? darius_sedai - 18/02/2010 12:27:58 AM 826 Views
Re: how is that a good comparrison? Lord Haart - 18/02/2010 03:30:21 AM 1310 Views
watch out that you don't fall when you jump on a bandwagon darius_sedai - 16/02/2010 01:51:09 AM 1012 Views
Re: watch out that you don't fall when you jump on a bandwagon Lord Haart - 16/02/2010 07:04:08 AM 983 Views
Alright enough. Will you read the books already? fionwe1987 - 16/02/2010 08:03:39 AM 1046 Views
Fair points, & I somehow forgot that paragraph. Lord Haart - 16/02/2010 05:34:12 PM 960 Views
You've forgotten a lot of paragraphs. fionwe1987 - 16/02/2010 07:58:32 PM 1062 Views
The point is people hold Egwene to a different standard for some reason darius_sedai - 16/02/2010 01:34:30 AM 821 Views
Re: The point is people hold Egwene to a different standard for some reason Lord Haart - 16/02/2010 07:08:13 AM 924 Views
I'm going to agee with fionwe darius_sedai - 16/02/2010 01:07:37 PM 883 Views
Same old same old Sidious - 16/02/2010 02:01:12 PM 907 Views
that B*TCH! *NM* darius_sedai - 17/02/2010 03:10:30 AM 663 Views
Re: Same old same old orius - 17/02/2010 09:32:03 AM 1034 Views
Yes, but Egwene's is pride - Lord Haart - 15/02/2010 07:04:25 PM 930 Views
I think Nyn has had the best character development, bar none beetnemesis - 15/02/2010 08:52:54 PM 913 Views
Re: I think Nyn has had the best character development, bar none Lord Haart - 15/02/2010 10:39:25 PM 935 Views
I feel Galad could be up there, but we see so little of him beetnemesis - 16/02/2010 12:28:44 AM 934 Views
are you being serious? darius_sedai - 16/02/2010 01:57:29 AM 896 Views
Re: are you being serious? Lord Haart - 16/02/2010 06:55:16 AM 996 Views
Oh, I don't think so. beetnemesis - 16/02/2010 09:12:57 AM 879 Views
Re: This is about Egwene, not Nynaeve. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 22/02/2010 10:57:27 PM 981 Views
Re: None of the Emond's Fielders suck up to him. There's difference between hostile and 1-upping orius - 15/02/2010 05:08:49 AM 949 Views
It amazes me that you use Rand as the gold standard for good behaviour Sidious - 15/02/2010 06:53:30 AM 890 Views
Re: It amazes me that you use Rand as the gold standard for good behaviour Lord Haart - 15/02/2010 08:41:02 AM 1142 Views
this is hilarious darius_sedai - 15/02/2010 12:45:22 PM 903 Views
Re: It amazes me that you use Rand as the gold standard for good behaviour Sidious - 15/02/2010 03:31:26 PM 1010 Views
Re: It amazes me that you use Rand as the gold standard for good behaviour Cannoli - 15/02/2010 11:57:24 AM 1168 Views
Who says Egwene didn't have a destiny? *NM* darius_sedai - 15/02/2010 12:46:10 PM 567 Views
Me. And I'm way smarter than you. Cannoli - 15/02/2010 01:04:48 PM 978 Views
darius_sedai - 15/02/2010 02:12:26 PM 1037 Views
Re: Lord Haart - 15/02/2010 10:40:39 PM 905 Views
Min's viewing of the Darkness v. fireflies very obviously shows that all the main darius_sedai - 16/02/2010 01:32:45 AM 865 Views
Re: Min's viewing of the Darkness v. fireflies very obviously shows that all the main Lord Haart - 16/02/2010 07:09:52 AM 938 Views
You need a re-read my friend darius_sedai - 16/02/2010 01:14:22 PM 924 Views
Re: It amazes me that you use Rand as the gold standard for good behaviour Sidious - 15/02/2010 03:48:51 PM 1063 Views
Sidious' problem in a nutshell. Cannoli - 15/02/2010 11:27:12 AM 1015 Views
Re: Sidious' problem in a nutshell. Sidious - 15/02/2010 03:14:55 PM 971 Views
I've never understood the fascination with Lanfear darius_sedai - 15/02/2010 05:52:27 PM 998 Views
Re: God I am so pissed off at Future Egwene Gerbeaud - 14/02/2010 07:56:23 PM 933 Views
Re: God I am so pissed off at Future Egwene BlackAdder - 14/02/2010 08:55:58 PM 876 Views
I'd venture the guess that it's what the called the Novices back then darius_sedai - 14/02/2010 08:59:26 PM 1001 Views
Re: I'd venture the guess that it's what the called the Novices back then BlackAdder - 14/02/2010 09:24:23 PM 842 Views
I don't think so darius_sedai - 14/02/2010 09:30:41 PM 865 Views
Re: I don't think so Gerbeaud - 15/02/2010 03:45:52 PM 964 Views
That's pretty much how I see it too darius_sedai - 15/02/2010 05:54:14 PM 891 Views
I understood little sister to be a mild insult, Moiraine being so young and weak in the OP *NM* Lordling - 16/02/2010 08:25:55 PM 647 Views
maybe a touch patronizing? *NM* darius_sedai - 17/02/2010 12:51:25 PM 522 Views
Appears to be, but his thought process implies it's not as simple as him merely looking down on her. *NM* Lord Haart - 17/02/2010 05:07:19 PM 487 Views
Yeah, I'm pretty sure it won't be flattering for Rand Yondaime - 14/02/2010 08:05:40 PM 1108 Views
Re: Yeah, I'm pretty sure it won't be flattering for Rand lilltempest - 14/02/2010 11:55:40 PM 1005 Views
Cadsuane needs to spank her. Great Lord of Chaos - 15/02/2010 01:31:49 AM 991 Views
yeah, that's worked so well on her in the past darius_sedai - 15/02/2010 01:48:05 AM 906 Views
It would be a very amusing moment. Great Lord of Chaos - 15/02/2010 03:01:37 AM 874 Views
IMO it would merely be a hypocritical moment of massive proportions darius_sedai - 15/02/2010 04:45:27 AM 861 Views
and a massive failure Sidious - 15/02/2010 06:57:18 AM 1001 Views
What Egwene needs is to be shown that her actions could harm the tower. Lord Haart - 15/02/2010 08:46:30 AM 785 Views
Actually that role is being played by Covril at the Stump *NM* darius_sedai - 15/02/2010 02:13:42 PM 604 Views
If you hate arrogance, you must hate all the main characters in the series Sidious - 15/02/2010 03:21:48 PM 825 Views
But that's the point Cannoli - 15/02/2010 03:26:03 PM 902 Views
Not quite. Lord Haart - 15/02/2010 07:11:56 PM 918 Views
Everyone else is shown to be a bit small minded. Egwene is implied to be Strong And Wise beetnemesis - 15/02/2010 09:23:47 PM 842 Views
When has she ever actually done that? Rand thinks she will, but so far she's done nothing like it! darius_sedai - 16/02/2010 02:08:23 AM 950 Views
I meant that EVERYONE is bargaining, posturing, etc. beetnemesis - 16/02/2010 02:54:29 AM 861 Views
Well miscommunication is one of the major themes of the series darius_sedai - 16/02/2010 01:17:25 PM 857 Views
the most idiotic theme IMO Sidious - 16/02/2010 03:27:26 PM 940 Views
I don't know if the theme itself is idoitic, but I would totally agree that it's gone nowhere! darius_sedai - 17/02/2010 03:16:30 AM 833 Views
Re: Everyone else is shown to be a bit small minded. Egwene is implied to be Strong And Wise Gerbeaud - 18/02/2010 01:19:00 AM 914 Views
Actually, you can't compare the two. Cannoli - 15/02/2010 12:04:19 PM 983 Views
No, Cannoli has the right of it here. lilltempest - 16/02/2010 06:22:39 PM 1002 Views
Re: No, Cannoli has the right of it here. Lordling - 16/02/2010 06:51:28 PM 1011 Views
Well, all those beatings were in private BlackAdder - 16/02/2010 07:54:00 PM 917 Views
That was the point of the scene in front of the Sitters during the banquet. *NM* RugbyPlayingAshaman - 23/02/2010 06:58:50 PM 598 Views
Oh the one where Elaida tried to have her way with Egwene while the Sitters looked away? *NM* BlackAdder - 23/02/2010 10:12:04 PM 621 Views
Yes. Elaida wanted Egwene to be cowed in front of her into obedience, which would erode her support RugbyPlayingAshaman - 23/02/2010 10:18:03 PM 955 Views
I actually think it will go the opposite way. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 16/02/2010 03:44:19 PM 940 Views
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