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*shudders* Yondaime Send a noteboard - 26/01/2010 02:27:35 AM
I'd like to see how confused you guys would be if we didn't have a compelled victim suddenly reverse after a balefire attack.




When I think about it, this scene would look a lot like Sammael's death then. A beam of balefire, followed by the unresolved question 'well, is did Rand get him?'


"Take the Gleeman!" Rand and Mat cried, throwing Thom to the Myrddraal. Then they ran away as fast as they could, and Thom's screams quickly faded into the distance along with any inconvenient feelings of guilt.
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Graendal's death would imply a major logical flaw in the story. fionwe1987 - 25/01/2010 05:18:23 PM 2951 Views
I think Graendal's death was a great scene Etzel - 25/01/2010 05:26:51 PM 1709 Views
The scene itself was great. The rest is crap. fionwe1987 - 25/01/2010 05:37:44 PM 1528 Views
After reading 12 WoT books... Etzel - 25/01/2010 05:46:31 PM 1582 Views
You also ignored... randfandom - 25/01/2010 08:15:34 PM 1575 Views
and of course, the obvious theme Sidious - 25/01/2010 09:02:56 PM 1431 Views
Bah! fionwe1987 - 25/01/2010 11:49:33 PM 1567 Views
It's possible that this was mainly written by BS Etzel - 26/01/2010 12:03:03 PM 1502 Views
I think playing too many games just messes up with the integrety and solidness of the books ... amirebram - 26/01/2010 09:46:16 PM 2979 Views
I agree that the set up for her death was rather lame darius_sedai - 25/01/2010 06:14:07 PM 1733 Views
I agree and have my own additional notes as to why I don't think she is dead. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 25/01/2010 06:18:30 PM 1537 Views
Re: I agree and have my own additional notes as to why I don't think she is dead. Underwood - 25/01/2010 06:44:34 PM 1478 Views
well one of her major character parallels is Josef Mengel darius_sedai - 25/01/2010 06:54:43 PM 1275 Views
Can you think of any way that would explain the Compulsion vanishing? beetnemesis - 25/01/2010 07:52:40 PM 1308 Views
that's kind of my whole point darius_sedai - 25/01/2010 08:43:19 PM 1243 Views
Uh, not actually at all really Sidious - 25/01/2010 09:07:52 PM 1551 Views
*shudders* Yondaime - 26/01/2010 02:27:35 AM 1415 Views
*shrugs* darius_sedai - 26/01/2010 08:47:21 AM 1461 Views
None of those "easy explanations" could work beetnemesis - 26/01/2010 07:14:16 AM 1363 Views
my entire problem with the scene is that it just felt too open ended darius_sedai - 26/01/2010 08:58:37 AM 1419 Views
Can't she knot it to disapate after being examined once? Rurouni_Kenshin - 26/01/2010 03:43:55 AM 1310 Views
Do we have evidence that this is possible? Yondaime - 26/01/2010 03:44:48 AM 1446 Views
why would Graendal do that anyway? Sidious - 26/01/2010 04:26:38 AM 1445 Views
Re: why would Graendal do that anyway? Rurouni_Kenshin - 03/02/2010 02:52:32 AM 1358 Views
Re: I agree and have my own additional notes as to why I don't think she is dead. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 26/01/2010 02:03:51 AM 1458 Views
I'm glad you think Be'lal is alive. Fanatic-Templar - 26/01/2010 07:38:40 AM 1234 Views
Re: I'm glad you think Be'lal is alive. darius_sedai - 26/01/2010 08:49:00 AM 1426 Views
Re: I'm glad you think Be'lal is alive. Lord Haart - 26/01/2010 09:19:35 AM 1246 Views
Moiraine probably learned it while researching with Adealas and Vandene. *NM* Gher - 26/01/2010 04:57:09 PM 937 Views
Sidious - 26/01/2010 11:42:04 AM 1416 Views
Didn't Balthamel and Aginor leave corpses? Fanatic-Templar - 26/01/2010 04:35:19 PM 1440 Views
Re: Didn't Balthamel and Aginor leave corpses? Sidious - 26/01/2010 07:06:01 PM 1305 Views
Re: RugbyPlayingAshaman - 26/01/2010 04:44:06 PM 1417 Views
He was balefired by a direct stream in front of at least two credible witnesses. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 26/01/2010 04:10:13 PM 1434 Views
Me, Too. The Name With No Man - 28/01/2010 08:00:09 PM 1403 Views
Re: I agree and have my own additional notes as to why I don't think she is dead. Sidious - 25/01/2010 08:56:16 PM 1496 Views
I believe she's dead Sareitha Sedai - 25/01/2010 09:06:37 PM 1353 Views
Re: I believe she's dead Sidious - 25/01/2010 09:09:58 PM 1390 Views
I don't think she would have taught anyone Sareitha Sedai - 25/01/2010 09:18:03 PM 1264 Views
Besides, if it wasn't Graendal, it implies that she knew of Rand's plan, which is not feasible *NM* Shannow - 26/01/2010 02:01:41 PM 736 Views
The compulsion did not disappear immediately. Read the damned scene! fionwe1987 - 25/01/2010 11:54:02 PM 1508 Views
Re: The compulsion did not disappear immediately. Read the damned scene! Underwood - 26/01/2010 01:22:57 AM 1264 Views
Stop passing judgments... fionwe1987 - 26/01/2010 02:05:21 AM 1463 Views
But your theories are becoming increasingly farfetched Sidious - 26/01/2010 04:21:21 AM 1347 Views
I repeat that I find her "death" monumental... fionwe1987 - 26/01/2010 07:16:13 PM 1321 Views
Re: I repeat that I find her "death" monumental... Sidious - 26/01/2010 07:23:29 PM 1356 Views
Dude, then you derailed the thread... fionwe1987 - 26/01/2010 07:31:55 PM 1228 Views
Not really Sidious - 26/01/2010 07:35:06 PM 1342 Views
Re: Not really fionwe1987 - 26/01/2010 07:45:20 PM 1429 Views
Re: Not really Sidious - 28/01/2010 04:27:17 PM 1334 Views
Re: Stop passing judgments... RugbyPlayingAshaman - 26/01/2010 04:40:37 PM 1315 Views
*NM* RugbyPlayingAshaman - 26/01/2010 05:00:10 PM 700 Views
Everyone can see residues- only a select few can "read" them beetnemesis - 26/01/2010 07:42:19 AM 1393 Views
no she said she wouldn't risk strength and skill in the same place darius_sedai - 26/01/2010 08:51:31 AM 1282 Views
Re: no she said she wouldn't risk strength and skill in the same place Sidious - 26/01/2010 11:37:26 AM 1440 Views
read the whole quote darius_sedai - 26/01/2010 04:35:17 PM 1069 Views
LOL! You read the whole quote Sidious - 26/01/2010 07:00:41 PM 1218 Views
the risk she won't take is strength and skill residing together. darius_sedai - 27/01/2010 12:40:09 AM 1275 Views
Re: the risk she won't take is strength and skill residing together. Sidious - 28/01/2010 04:28:21 PM 1394 Views
I don't see any flaws. Skeeve the Great - 25/01/2010 09:14:44 PM 1490 Views
But... fionwe1987 - 25/01/2010 11:44:49 PM 1231 Views
Re: But... Skeeve the Great - 26/01/2010 01:14:51 AM 1382 Views
That is what I thought ... Yondaime - 26/01/2010 01:24:18 AM 1266 Views
That still doesn't make sense. fionwe1987 - 26/01/2010 02:23:12 AM 1475 Views
But, having a clean up guy does make sense. Yondaime - 26/01/2010 03:02:13 AM 1476 Views
But the clean up guy would require another clean up guy! fionwe1987 - 26/01/2010 03:35:44 AM 1304 Views
Re: But the clean up guy would require another clean up guy! Yondaime - 26/01/2010 04:12:41 AM 1280 Views
Nonsense. Fanatic-Templar - 26/01/2010 07:50:04 AM 1189 Views
Dude, read what I said please... fionwe1987 - 26/01/2010 07:21:52 PM 1399 Views
Re: Dude, read what I said please... Fanatic-Templar - 26/01/2010 09:28:25 PM 1362 Views
Kerb had no initiative... he was under too heavy a Compulsion to think for himself darius_sedai - 27/01/2010 12:45:47 AM 1235 Views
I think he had some, albeit probably not a whole lot Yondaime - 27/01/2010 01:03:44 AM 1289 Views
Nynaeve and Elayne were under a weaker compulsion... fionwe1987 - 27/01/2010 03:10:52 AM 1134 Views
We don't know that, exactly Yondaime - 27/01/2010 03:50:44 AM 1177 Views
If you cannot provide an answer... fionwe1987 - 27/01/2010 03:10:40 AM 1269 Views
Seriously? Fanatic-Templar - 27/01/2010 03:55:57 AM 1313 Views
Maybe... Etzel - 27/01/2010 11:08:10 AM 1244 Views
Messenger was running around being obvious. Noone would suspect Kerb though. Case Closed. *NM* Lord Haart - 26/01/2010 11:08:16 AM 847 Views
Thank the creator you're not in the police then. *NM* fionwe1987 - 26/01/2010 07:22:29 PM 806 Views
Ok, in more detail: Lord Haart - 26/01/2010 08:16:30 PM 1400 Views
I'm tired of making this point... fionwe1987 - 26/01/2010 08:39:22 PM 1143 Views
Re: I'm tired of making this point... Syraelle - 26/01/2010 08:44:51 PM 1304 Views
Thoughts Heiko - 26/01/2010 01:05:45 AM 1221 Views
But that means she's dead Skeeve the Great - 26/01/2010 01:20:19 AM 1294 Views
Re: But that means she's dead Heiko - 26/01/2010 05:31:25 AM 1386 Views
Nope. Ramshalan was just "collecting taxes" or something. Lord Haart - 26/01/2010 11:10:25 AM 1183 Views
Re: Nope. Ramshalan was NOT just "collecting taxes" or something. Syraelle - 26/01/2010 05:41:17 PM 1254 Views
By, the way, if I understand this correctly... Fanatic-Templar - 26/01/2010 04:49:45 PM 1486 Views
Indeed... Etzel - 26/01/2010 05:13:53 PM 1450 Views
Re: Indeed... Sidious - 26/01/2010 07:04:40 PM 1304 Views
I'm not arguing she's alive, but... fionwe1987 - 26/01/2010 07:29:42 PM 1299 Views
Re: I'm not arguing she's alive, but... Underwood - 26/01/2010 07:58:41 PM 1263 Views
Re: I'm not arguing she's alive, but... Fanatic-Templar - 26/01/2010 09:42:52 PM 1061 Views
Re: I'm not arguing she's alive, but... fionwe1987 - 27/01/2010 03:26:46 AM 1333 Views
Re: I'm not arguing she's alive, but... Fanatic-Templar - 27/01/2010 04:05:23 AM 1409 Views
That's not fair Yondaime - 27/01/2010 04:09:38 AM 1258 Views
I agree about the 'awesome' part . Fanatic-Templar - 27/01/2010 05:41:00 AM 1208 Views
Does anybody have a link to it? (nothing on Google). I'm intrigued. *NM* Lord Haart - 27/01/2010 08:27:13 AM 746 Views
It was on Wotmania. Someone copied all the theories, but I don't recall whom. *NM* Fanatic-Templar - 27/01/2010 08:31:00 AM 873 Views
I just think it's funny that what you call omniscience has been done by the Forsaken before. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 27/01/2010 02:02:44 PM 1220 Views
But Graendal was the victim of a greater plot. Lord Haart - 27/01/2010 05:30:28 PM 1336 Views
So your response is that Ishamael/Moridin is omniscient, not Graendal. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 27/01/2010 05:57:20 PM 1434 Views
Re: So your response is that Ishamael/Moridin is omniscient, not Graendal. Lord Haart - 28/01/2010 04:05:21 AM 1406 Views
Give me one example. Just one. *NM* Fanatic-Templar - 27/01/2010 06:52:44 PM 820 Views
Ishamael plans millennia ahead by sowing the seeds for the Black Ajah, the Seanchan and the current RugbyPlayingAshaman - 28/01/2010 01:57:39 PM 1375 Views
Not even comparable. Fanatic-Templar - 28/01/2010 06:31:06 PM 1138 Views
Re: Not even comparable. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 28/01/2010 07:50:38 PM 1275 Views
Could you please take the effort to read my posts? Fanatic-Templar - 28/01/2010 10:45:01 PM 1233 Views
Re: Could you please take the effort to read my posts? RugbyPlayingAshaman - 29/01/2010 03:49:43 PM 1283 Views
Re: Could you please take the effort to read my posts? Fanatic-Templar - 29/01/2010 06:40:43 PM 1281 Views
And, just to double post: Fanatic-Templar - 27/01/2010 07:12:17 PM 1029 Views
Re: And, just to double post: RugbyPlayingAshaman - 27/01/2010 08:25:45 PM 1357 Views
Nice answer. Fanatic-Templar - 28/01/2010 12:10:27 AM 1333 Views
Re: Nice answer. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 28/01/2010 01:55:16 PM 1277 Views
Hilarious. Fanatic-Templar - 28/01/2010 06:36:22 PM 1405 Views
Re: Hilarious. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 28/01/2010 07:15:20 PM 1282 Views
Re: Hilarious. Fanatic-Templar - 28/01/2010 07:41:29 PM 1308 Views
Re: Hilarious. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 28/01/2010 07:53:34 PM 1163 Views
Re: Hilarious. Fanatic-Templar - 28/01/2010 10:55:57 PM 1338 Views
That's because you didn't look at other posts. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 29/01/2010 03:37:08 PM 1277 Views
Moridin's main directive was.. Etzel - 29/01/2010 03:57:41 PM 1322 Views
Re: Moridin's main directive was.. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 29/01/2010 04:50:16 PM 1400 Views
Preventing order wasn't accomplished... Etzel - 29/01/2010 05:12:22 PM 1327 Views
I disagree. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 29/01/2010 05:28:59 PM 1701 Views
I will stop our discussion here; the posts are already pushed too far to the right of my display. *NM* Etzel - 29/01/2010 06:14:29 PM 663 Views
You expect me to search every post you've made on this forum, ever? Fanatic-Templar - 29/01/2010 06:50:49 PM 1258 Views
Re: I'm not arguing she's alive, but... Skeeve the Great - 27/01/2010 01:00:42 AM 1281 Views
Re: I'm not arguing she's alive, but... fionwe1987 - 27/01/2010 03:26:56 AM 1320 Views
Re: I'm not arguing she's alive, but... Skeeve the Great - 27/01/2010 05:35:39 AM 1273 Views
I don't see a flaw rAndy aL - 27/01/2010 06:24:44 AM 1360 Views
Re: I don't see a flaw Underwood - 27/01/2010 04:18:27 PM 1337 Views
Yup, I'm tired of seeing arguments that ignore the need to back up their own claims. Lord Haart - 27/01/2010 05:47:16 PM 1313 Views
Let's give you one logic path for Millisair being poisoned. TheUltimateReality - 27/01/2010 05:47:04 PM 1328 Views
Spot on. *NM* Lord Haart - 28/01/2010 04:09:26 AM 812 Views
I don't think there's a flaw, I think you misinterpret Graendal's plans DomA - 27/01/2010 06:57:44 PM 1307 Views
Good point on Ituralde - he may still be Compulsed in ways we're yet to discover. *NM* Lord Haart - 28/01/2010 04:11:15 AM 782 Views
Compulsion is limited Sidious - 28/01/2010 04:30:24 PM 1259 Views
Re: Compulsion is limited Lord Haart - 28/01/2010 06:35:05 PM 1413 Views
Re: Compulsion is limited DomA - 28/01/2010 08:26:37 PM 1199 Views
Re: Graendal's death would imply a major logical flaw in the story. taura-tierno - 27/01/2010 09:11:32 PM 1295 Views
There's really no further purpose for her character. Libby - 09/02/2010 10:52:58 PM 1364 Views
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