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I'm not trying to defend Gnosticism doctrinally, but... Tom Send a noteboard - 24/09/2012 11:51:40 PM
From a strictly logical perspective, your arguments are circular. Pauline sources validated a gospel, therefore it is true. The gospel is true because it reaffirms what the people who recognized it believed.

The proponent of a Gnostic vision of Christianity will counter that, had Valentinus not lost the PR war inside Christianity (by having a message that was less popular but which could theoretically have been more correct and closer to the real teachings of Jesus), we would have plenty of Valentinian sources that would renounce, say, the Gospels of Matthew and Luke, as well as the writings of Eusebius, Irenaeus, and Tertullian, as "heretical". The "Orthodox Gnostic Church" would base its claim to orthodoxy on the fact that Valentinus was taught by Paul's disciple, Theudas.
Political correctness is the pettiest form of casuistry.

ἡ δὲ κἀκ τριῶν τρυπημάτων ἐργαζομένη ἐνεκάλει τῇ φύσει, δυσφορουμένη, ὅτι δὴ μὴ καὶ τοὺς τιτθοὺς αὐτῇ εὐρύτερον ἢ νῦν εἰσι τρυπώη, ὅπως καὶ ἄλλην ἐνταῦθα μίξιν ἐπιτεχνᾶσθαι δυνατὴ εἴη. – Procopius

Ummaka qinnassa nīk!

*MySmiley*
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So, about this silly "Jesus' wife" story making the rounds... - 19/09/2012 10:55:55 PM 1330 Views
That's right! Jesus' position on marriage was "One man, no woman." *NM* - 19/09/2012 11:05:55 PM 659 Views
What is the context? The canonical bible says Christ has a wife: The Church. - 19/09/2012 11:25:19 PM 967 Views
Oh please...don't confuse "wife" with "bride" - 19/09/2012 11:35:09 PM 937 Views
What word do the Prophets use for Israels relationship to God? - 20/09/2012 12:38:20 AM 915 Views
BRIDE - 20/09/2012 03:39:30 PM 902 Views
Two things why it is important - 20/09/2012 04:24:37 AM 890 Views
There is a very good reason no one dismissed the illegitmate gospels as illegitimate until 180 AD: - 20/09/2012 09:15:05 PM 854 Views
The Gospel of Thomas was written before 180 AD. - 20/09/2012 09:33:44 PM 847 Views
What is the oldest extant text of or reference to it? - 20/09/2012 11:11:03 PM 919 Views
The Oxyrhynchus fragments were dated to c. 200 AD, and they are copies - 21/09/2012 12:18:33 AM 839 Views
I would buy 200 AD, of course. - 21/09/2012 12:58:32 AM 900 Views
It's not about "buying" it - it's essentially proven at that point. - 21/09/2012 03:26:50 AM 872 Views
Yes; all I meant was that I never disputed a date around 200 AD. - 22/09/2012 12:25:41 AM 891 Views
I don't think any of the gospels were written by their purported authors. - 22/09/2012 03:36:32 AM 802 Views
Not even Mark or Luke? - 22/09/2012 01:21:24 PM 848 Views
Well, but everyone knew Peter didn't speak Greek - 22/09/2012 09:46:57 PM 789 Views
True, but everyone also knew Paul spoke it fluently, and he would have been an ideal choice. - 24/09/2012 06:20:22 AM 853 Views
Some people did "lie big". - 24/09/2012 02:11:58 PM 876 Views
I forgot about (or possibly repressed memories of) the Gnostics "Gospel" of Peter. - 24/09/2012 11:26:43 PM 958 Views
I'm not trying to defend Gnosticism doctrinally, but... - 24/09/2012 11:51:40 PM 918 Views
I am not relying SOLELY (or chiefly) on popularity though. - 25/09/2012 02:21:01 AM 899 Views
The Gnostic response would be: - 25/09/2012 06:01:58 AM 815 Views
What about those who postulate a mid-to-late 1st century composition? - 22/09/2012 02:21:18 AM 913 Views
Elaine Pagels ceased to be an impartial academic a long time ago. - 22/09/2012 03:41:41 AM 873 Views
Suspected as much, but wanted to see if you thought so as well - 22/09/2012 03:47:05 AM 1013 Views
Let's not get started on Funk - 22/09/2012 09:48:05 PM 807 Views
So true - 22/09/2012 10:23:08 PM 912 Views
don't these people have anything better to do? - 20/09/2012 11:39:35 PM 910 Views
Clearly not. - 22/09/2012 12:27:29 AM 747 Views
then i'll escape this thread before anyone twigs - 22/09/2012 08:12:37 PM 984 Views
Too late, I have already twigged, branched and treed. - 22/09/2012 08:58:39 PM 893 Views
I know! - 21/09/2012 06:48:33 AM 1100 Views
See, Tom, you made a mistake. - 22/09/2012 10:25:22 AM 880 Views

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