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Re: Yes that's a pet theory of mine DomA Send a noteboard - 25/10/2012 08:50:15 PM
I'm hoping that he will be able to overwhelm the Dreamspike. It will be excellent.


Indeed.

But seriosly, isn't this way too late in the series for resolving this plotline?


Resolving it positively otherwise than by facing and defeating the DL forces during TG? Yes, I think so.

Rand's plans seem to focus on gathering his forces and striking at SG ASAP. I think it's pretty much out of question that, as things stand now, he's planning an attack on the BT. He's probably more concerned about getting the hundreds innocents out of there eventually (before they become hostages), but otherwise I think he's rather counting on his breaking the seals and launching TG to get the Shadow's forces in the open.

My impression is that currently, almost everyone at the Black Tower has been forcibly turned to the shadow, with Rand possibly not even aware that this has happened.


After his epiphany he seemed aware that something very wrong is going on, but as far as we know he just sent Naeff, and possibly just from afar to gather intelligence.

Quite aside from representing a power more than matching the White Tower, these guys shold relatively easily be able to infiltrate the good guys.


No chance of that. The time of infiltration is pretty much over. Between the Red Veils and Tarna, it's very obvious people who have been turned are very easy to identify. They have glassy inhuman eyes, and aren't themselves anymore. For the AS, the ones who have not been turned are BA - already exposed by Verin. "Turnings" aren't about fooling people with sleeper agents, it's about recruiting "soldiers" against their wil and depriving the enemy of them.

The Asha'man from Taim's faction who have not been turned but are DF are known by the other Asha'man to belong to Taim's faction - not a chance they can infiltrate the other side.

Unless some way can be found to unturn people from the shadow in bulk, like killing the Myrddraal that was used to turn them, or something, I don't see how this can be resolved in time at all.


It's conceivable Nynaeve could find a way to remove1reverse the turning, that it's not very different from the network of taint on a brain (it seems to "shut" off emotions like empathy, and exacerbate all the darker, buried aspects in a personality) but I seriously doubt this would happen in a "strategic" way, to deprive Taim of his dread lords. If it happens, it's far more likely to concern a character or small group of characters who've been turned and got captured by the Light during or after TG.

But I agree with you this storyline seems to be heading, and very soon, for a "and so Taim's plans succeeded" resolution.

My hunch is that there's no "Logain's visit" in the works. This is just a pretext Taim came up with to have every channeller on the grounds gather in one place (indoor, if the rain goes on) to "deal with them". They will gather to listen to Logain's announcement, there won't be any Logain (not the real one anyway) and Taim will strike.

We'll see if Pevara and Androl escape or not, and what will happen too with the 47 ex-rebels. Will there be a fight they'll lose almost instantly? Will Pevara go to them in her escape or leave them there? Will a lot of people be captured?

My suspicion is that the downpour is intentional and could be meant to hide the fact four leagues from there Caemlyn is under attack.. But it's very hard to guess where on the timeline the last Pevara scene happens. It could now be in sync and happen on the eve of Merrilor, but we could be many days or weeks behind, as for the earlier scenes.

I'm pretty sure the real Logain and most of his faction (those not left behind as soldiers here and there) are quite simply at Merrilor right now, the way Perrin suggested to Rand he could send all the Asha'man to Caemlyn's rescue speaks in favour of that.
This message last edited by DomA on 25/10/2012 at 08:59:32 PM
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Ch2 : Pevara & Androl and channeling implications - 24/10/2012 06:40:47 PM 2924 Views
Did Perva actually initiate the link or was it Androl? *NM* - 24/10/2012 07:02:15 PM 755 Views
Androl did. *NM* - 25/10/2012 05:10:31 AM 1006 Views
But didn't Nynaeve do it first at the cleansing? - 25/10/2012 12:43:15 PM 1269 Views
Pevara was thinking on very sketchy information. - 25/10/2012 08:56:20 PM 1204 Views
did he start the link? or just take it? - 27/10/2012 07:33:49 AM 895 Views
I think it's slightly off - 28/10/2012 04:21:05 PM 1164 Views
Re: Ch2 : Pevara & Androl and channeling implications - 25/10/2012 05:13:43 AM 1413 Views
Re: Ch2 : Pevara & Androl and channeling implications - 25/10/2012 04:23:20 PM 1210 Views
Re: Ch2 : Pevara & Androl and channeling implications - 25/10/2012 09:52:03 PM 1258 Views
Travelling - 25/10/2012 08:56:41 AM 1250 Views
Yes that's a pet theory of mine - 25/10/2012 04:21:53 PM 1270 Views
Re: Yes that's a pet theory of mine - 25/10/2012 06:12:21 PM 1191 Views
Re: Yes that's a pet theory of mine - 25/10/2012 08:50:15 PM 1111 Views
Re: Yes that's a pet theory of mine - 25/10/2012 09:45:26 PM 1202 Views
Weren't there 150 or so at Maradon? *NM* - 26/10/2012 03:29:53 PM 666 Views
Re: Yes that's a pet theory of mine - 26/10/2012 08:49:58 PM 1309 Views
Perhaps, but if no on in the AoL could do it when mixed circles were common - 28/10/2012 04:22:20 PM 993 Views
How strong Pevara is... - 25/10/2012 07:08:26 PM 1341 Views
I'm pretty sure Moiraine is closer to 30... - 25/10/2012 07:41:37 PM 1050 Views
Agreed - 25/10/2012 08:37:24 PM 1138 Views
So... the old story of ignore the bell curve, eh? - 26/10/2012 01:40:49 AM 1109 Views
No, I fully respect the bell curve - 26/10/2012 01:51:34 PM 1161 Views
That was disproved long ago... - 26/10/2012 01:36:24 AM 1132 Views
But Moiraine isn't 'exceptionally strong' - 26/10/2012 05:16:10 AM 1168 Views
Not particularly strong evidence for that last. - 26/10/2012 05:36:54 AM 1126 Views
But we know that it takes significantly more strength to maintain multiple weaves - 26/10/2012 08:14:58 AM 1042 Views
Not true - 27/10/2012 09:15:51 PM 1058 Views
Not accurate - 27/10/2012 09:31:05 PM 1032 Views
The Bell Curve explained... - 26/10/2012 10:27:34 AM 1089 Views
Re: The Bell Curve explained... - 26/10/2012 11:40:04 AM 1086 Views
Re: The Bell Curve explained... - 26/10/2012 12:32:01 PM 1011 Views
Re: The Bell Curve explained... - 26/10/2012 12:48:51 PM 1136 Views
Re: The Bell Curve explained... - 26/10/2012 01:07:39 PM 1110 Views
Re: The Bell Curve explained... - 26/10/2012 01:18:32 PM 1139 Views
Re: The Bell Curve explained... - 26/10/2012 01:57:18 PM 1173 Views
Re: The Bell Curve explained... - 28/10/2012 02:07:39 PM 883 Views
Yet Sharina, Nynaeve etc exist, thus the BC is the same - 27/10/2012 09:39:58 PM 1227 Views
The curve is OBVIOUSLY the same... - 28/10/2012 01:50:37 AM 966 Views
Re: The curve is OBVIOUSLY the same... - 28/10/2012 02:01:59 PM 1059 Views
You need to go read RJ's quotes: - 28/10/2012 02:41:49 PM 1082 Views
Re: You need to go read RJ's quotes: - 28/10/2012 05:39:12 PM 981 Views
I need to come and save you from blatant fallacies being spouted by the loonies. - 28/10/2012 05:56:21 PM 993 Views
This is like watching a train-wreck. - 29/10/2012 02:58:51 AM 951 Views
Re: This is like watching a train-wreck. - 29/10/2012 01:10:35 PM 1181 Views
So what's your conclusion? - 29/10/2012 02:14:33 PM 965 Views
His conclusion is that RJ was right about the books he wrote... - 29/10/2012 02:19:59 PM 1068 Views
Pretty much... - 30/10/2012 12:57:41 AM 1169 Views
Excellent points... - 29/10/2012 02:16:39 PM 946 Views
Re: Excellent points... - 29/10/2012 02:47:30 PM 1069 Views
You seem confused. - 29/10/2012 03:22:47 PM 932 Views
Re: You seem confused. - 29/10/2012 03:41:48 PM 984 Views
I think the point is that the AS didn't go force every woman in the area - 29/10/2012 07:57:59 PM 932 Views
Re: You seem confused. - 29/10/2012 08:23:22 PM 1104 Views
Re: You seem confused. - 29/10/2012 08:57:11 PM 1078 Views
He drew graphs! - 30/10/2012 12:49:09 AM 963 Views
Re: He drew graphs! - 30/10/2012 07:43:54 AM 1028 Views
Re: He drew graphs! - 30/10/2012 01:57:05 PM 979 Views
Re: Excellent points... - 30/10/2012 12:20:00 AM 1011 Views
Re: Excellent points... - 30/10/2012 07:49:57 AM 1022 Views
Re: Excellent points... - 30/10/2012 01:05:45 PM 1365 Views
Re: Excellent points... - 30/10/2012 01:25:11 PM 1037 Views
Re: Excellent points... - 30/10/2012 12:20:17 AM 1128 Views
AS recruiting is minimal - 28/10/2012 10:41:29 PM 987 Views
Re: You need to go read RJ's quotes: - 29/10/2012 02:23:27 AM 984 Views
Re: You need to go read RJ's quotes: - 29/10/2012 07:33:44 AM 997 Views
Huh? - 29/10/2012 02:26:27 PM 1004 Views
Re: Huh? - 29/10/2012 02:42:07 PM 959 Views
You don't seem to know what random means... - 29/10/2012 03:25:57 PM 970 Views
Re: You don't seem to know what random means... - 29/10/2012 03:36:45 PM 1004 Views
Personally I just think that 1000 women being allowed to tag along is a drop - 29/10/2012 08:05:33 PM 1028 Views
Re: Personally I just think that 1000 women being allowed to tag along is a drop - 29/10/2012 09:04:02 PM 1056 Views
Geography alone can do this - 30/10/2012 12:39:53 AM 976 Views
Re: Geography alone can do this - 30/10/2012 09:45:58 AM 965 Views
Not really - 30/10/2012 02:49:05 PM 955 Views
Here's why its not random... - 30/10/2012 01:04:18 AM 954 Views
Re: Here's why its not random... - 30/10/2012 09:42:35 AM 1102 Views
Re: Here's why its not random... - 30/10/2012 01:51:03 PM 950 Views
Re: Here's why its not random... - 30/10/2012 02:21:04 PM 992 Views
YEah, there's no point debating this... - 30/10/2012 02:46:39 PM 985 Views
Genetics plays a role - 30/10/2012 03:03:41 PM 1111 Views
Re: You don't seem to know what random means... - 29/10/2012 08:22:40 PM 939 Views
Re: You don't seem to know what random means... - 29/10/2012 09:06:08 PM 991 Views
Why must there be a mechanism? - 30/10/2012 01:06:29 AM 964 Views
Re: Why must there be a mechanism? - 30/10/2012 09:48:16 AM 895 Views
Nope... - 30/10/2012 01:43:56 PM 1095 Views
Re: Nope... - 30/10/2012 02:34:51 PM 954 Views
Oh my... - 30/10/2012 02:50:12 PM 1015 Views
Thought experment time! Hurrah! - 30/10/2012 03:27:01 PM 960 Views
But it is still possible in your example to get wildly varied results - 30/10/2012 03:30:59 PM 903 Views
Re: But it is still possible in your example to get wildly varied results - 30/10/2012 03:36:03 PM 993 Views
LOL - 30/10/2012 04:49:06 PM 1532 Views
Re: Yet Sharina, Nynaeve etc exist, thus the BC is the same - 28/10/2012 01:39:55 PM 963 Views
The point is there are still people being born in the highest strength categories - 28/10/2012 04:18:55 PM 1013 Views
Re: The point is there are still people being born in the highest strength categories - 28/10/2012 05:21:44 PM 993 Views
The curve hasn't shifted! - 28/10/2012 05:39:42 PM 1088 Views
The fact is, Moiraine is not half as strong as Lanfear, hence she is below average strength. - 28/10/2012 06:02:04 PM 1029 Views
How is this fact? - 29/10/2012 02:59:49 AM 1046 Views
Re: How is this fact? - 29/10/2012 07:04:15 PM 1006 Views
Not so - 29/10/2012 08:09:29 PM 984 Views
Re: Not so - 29/10/2012 08:43:16 PM 1047 Views
Sure it is - 30/10/2012 01:43:39 AM 945 Views
Explain Elza-Merise-Cadsuane then... - 29/10/2012 08:20:14 PM 970 Views
Re: Explain Elza-Merise-Cadsuane then... - 29/10/2012 08:38:11 PM 1024 Views
Are you blind man? - 30/10/2012 01:12:26 AM 1001 Views
Re: Are you blind man? - 30/10/2012 09:23:37 AM 1040 Views
Cadsuane is just below Egwene... - 30/10/2012 01:37:54 PM 970 Views
Your strength scores don't square with the Pevara quote - 30/10/2012 03:15:22 PM 972 Views
Re: The curve hasn't shifted! - 28/10/2012 07:36:36 PM 1002 Views
On Raw strength scores I think you are pretty inline with my thinking - 27/10/2012 09:37:25 PM 1138 Views
And the facing a Foresaken comment is out of context anyway... - 28/10/2012 01:56:12 AM 1097 Views
Excellent point on raw v. Effective strength *NM* - 28/10/2012 04:13:21 PM 662 Views

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