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Re: OK I'm sorry but this gets a huge ROFL :lol: Sidious Send a noteboard - 08/01/2010 01:53:25 PM
ROFL

I'm sorry but if you think Rand was in any threat going against any of the other Forsaken earlier in the series when he was at his weakest and least effective, than I don't know what to tell you.

He *almost* got sliced by Asmo's hair thin trap, but *luckily* he didn't
He *almost* was blown up by Asmo's exposive wards while chasing him, but *luckily* he conveniently threw up a superhard bubble of Air
He *almost* got his foot sliced off by his own closing Gateway while chasing Asmo, but *luckily* it only took off a bit of his heel
He *almost* died when Rahvin's trap triggered, but *luckily* it killed everyone around him but him
He *almost* got balefired himself, but *luckily* he wove it in the microsecond before it hit him and both canceled each other out
He *almost* got killed alongside Aviendha and Egwene while fighting the Shaido but *luckily* he didn't (and used a cushion of Air to save them all which we have never seen duplicated nor mentioned again in the series despite it's usefulness)

I'm sorry, but I have to do a ROFL ESPECIALLY when you say "How do you surprise someone who can't be surprised" when we have seen Graendal surprised by Sammael into remaining in their partnership and then bated into anger and almost standing and fighting Lanfear (BTW she would have been quite "surprised" if Sammael had done whatever he was going to do rather be interrupted).

I mean, I'm sorry, but the series is just not set up to really accept that he had no choices. So, as I said before, I understand that you are trying to defend his status of a mass murderer by implying that he had no choice, but he's actually been on quite a roll in the last few books wiping the floor with anyone who directly attacks him.

My point IS that a debate about whether Rand had a choice is meaningless because using Tel'Aran'Rhiod or his Talent for Travelling could have conceivably been used as a convenient plot point to drop him right on Graendal's head.

But that was not your question: Your question was "Did Rand become a psycho?" And my answer is, and remains, yes. Did he mass murder people and consider it a couple more times in the books? Yes. Did he have a choice as to how he confronted Graendal? Yes; but he didn't - because it wouldn't have fit the plot.

I mean, at this point in the story, he could have forced his t'a'veren powers to make Graendal have a stroke or Travel right to him, and it might have happened.


Actually I don't think there is any conceivable way he could have killed or caught Graendal other than surprising her like he did. Lews Therin makes it quite clear that Graendal cannot be baited, ambushed or tracked. He says that she is verifiably more intelligent and devious than him.

I think Graendal had plans we couldn't even conceive of - wardings all over the place, decoys etc. She told Sammael she hopes he has a backup plan after Ilian, which implies that she certainly did if Rand ever went for her.

Moghedien is possibly the most impossible Forsaken to find, but Graendal is second - and she won't give into a grudge like Moghedien will. She'll happily move along to her next base and cause havoc there.

Despite all Rand did, and despite his desperation to catch this woman, WE are still fighting over whether the woman is alive or not. It's a clear indication that even we as readers think she could have escaped that deadly scenario.
Wheel of Time board admin
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Rand the psycho? - 06/01/2010 02:53:30 AM 1701 Views
I cannot follow your assumptions. - 06/01/2010 04:07:33 AM 1108 Views
On Balefire - 06/01/2010 04:43:18 AM 1105 Views
Good point - 06/01/2010 05:04:26 AM 1131 Views
On the nature of BaleFire - 06/01/2010 03:32:25 PM 1030 Views
Re: I cannot follow your assumptions. - 06/01/2010 04:59:12 AM 928 Views
Wait! - 06/01/2010 05:10:33 AM 1044 Views
Re: Wait! - 06/01/2010 05:20:02 AM 953 Views
Re: Wait! - 06/01/2010 05:58:00 AM 941 Views
Re: Wait! - 06/01/2010 11:46:13 AM 883 Views
Re: Wait! - 06/01/2010 03:55:01 PM 895 Views
I disagree - 06/01/2010 05:42:44 PM 848 Views
Re: I disagree - 06/01/2010 06:41:08 PM 883 Views
Re: I disagree - 07/01/2010 04:42:40 AM 872 Views
I doubt he meant 'in one go' as a single stream of balefire. - 06/01/2010 07:30:56 AM 1002 Views
Re: I doubt he meant 'in one go' as a single stream of balefire. - 06/01/2010 03:32:24 PM 905 Views
Re: I doubt he meant 'in one go' as a single stream of balefire. - 06/01/2010 09:52:47 PM 978 Views
Re: I doubt he meant 'in one go' as a single stream of balefire. - 06/01/2010 11:19:56 PM 908 Views
Re: I doubt he meant 'in one go' as a single stream of balefire. - 07/01/2010 12:21:50 AM 964 Views
Re: I doubt he meant 'in one go' as a single stream of balefire. - 07/01/2010 12:56:26 AM 900 Views
Re: I doubt he meant 'in one go' as a single stream of balefire. - 07/01/2010 01:46:16 AM 960 Views
I agree with Templar - 09/01/2010 04:36:20 PM 870 Views
Re: I cannot follow your assumptions. - 06/01/2010 07:57:54 AM 992 Views
Rand crossed a line - 06/01/2010 02:36:42 PM 1000 Views
Re: Rand crossed a line - 06/01/2010 04:16:12 PM 940 Views
But... - 06/01/2010 04:34:02 PM 1029 Views
Re: But... - 06/01/2010 06:14:25 PM 836 Views
Doesn't Balefire remove your thread from the Pattern permanently? - 06/01/2010 02:55:38 PM 979 Views
No, RJ stated balefired people can be reborn. *NM* - 06/01/2010 03:26:00 PM 477 Views
But not in this turning of the Wheel. So they'd miss out on MANY lifetimes. - 06/01/2010 05:46:04 PM 908 Views
What? - 06/01/2010 06:20:56 PM 922 Views
Where did you get that? - 06/01/2010 07:09:38 PM 873 Views
No, balefire just kills you backwards in time. It is not super-death. *NM* - 06/01/2010 09:58:18 PM 492 Views
LOL ... super-death! - 06/01/2010 11:59:31 PM 844 Views
Hah! *NM* - 07/01/2010 12:06:07 AM 487 Views
It makes me think of History of the World Part 1 - 07/01/2010 12:53:20 AM 864 Views
It makes me think of History of the World Part 1 - 07/01/2010 12:53:33 AM 832 Views
Yes it was. - 06/01/2010 06:51:15 PM 979 Views
Re: Yes it was. - 06/01/2010 07:16:14 PM 902 Views
Re: Yes it was. - 06/01/2010 08:58:40 PM 929 Views
Re: Yes it was. - 06/01/2010 10:47:11 PM 929 Views
let me ask the question in a different way - 06/01/2010 11:26:43 PM 919 Views
Re: let me ask the question in a different way - 06/01/2010 11:40:56 PM 914 Views
actually that quote supports my thoughts - 06/01/2010 11:50:40 PM 961 Views
Re: actually that quote supports my thoughts - 07/01/2010 12:10:07 AM 868 Views
Meh. I just think advocating mass-murder is the opposite direction RJ meant for this to take. - 07/01/2010 12:00:44 AM 982 Views
Sigh. What mass murder? - 07/01/2010 12:15:01 AM 817 Views
you are kidding right? - 07/01/2010 12:19:58 AM 922 Views
In this book Rand was a wimp and a bully. - 07/01/2010 03:14:32 PM 883 Views
Re: In this book Rand was a wimp and a bully. - 07/01/2010 03:57:43 PM 909 Views
Re: In this book Rand was a wimp and a bully. - 07/01/2010 07:13:21 PM 919 Views
Re: In this book Rand was a wimp and a bully. - 07/01/2010 07:52:24 PM 858 Views
Re: In this book Rand was a wimp and a bully. - 07/01/2010 08:56:43 PM 939 Views
Re: In this book Rand was a wimp and a bully. - 07/01/2010 09:26:01 PM 876 Views
Re: In this book Rand was a wimp and a bully. - 07/01/2010 09:30:45 PM 810 Views
Personally I'm kind of sick of Rand being the only person killing FS! - 07/01/2010 09:42:57 PM 977 Views
Re: In this book Rand was a wimp and a bully. - 07/01/2010 09:56:02 PM 925 Views
OK I'm sorry but this gets a huge ROFL :lol: - 07/01/2010 10:30:19 PM 924 Views
Re: OK I'm sorry but this gets a huge ROFL :lol: - 08/01/2010 01:53:25 PM 875 Views
Re: OK I'm sorry but this gets a huge ROFL :lol: - 08/01/2010 02:56:41 PM 908 Views
What might work... - 08/01/2010 12:35:17 PM 818 Views
Re: What might work... - 08/01/2010 11:38:09 PM 836 Views
Yes. Anakin Skywalker all over again - 06/01/2010 11:01:02 PM 1001 Views
Meh - 06/01/2010 11:30:24 PM 838 Views
The worst part about his atrocities is his rationalizing them! - 06/01/2010 11:33:32 PM 841 Views
Re: The worst part about his atrocities is his rationalizing them! - 06/01/2010 11:50:37 PM 928 Views
Re: The worst part about his atrocities is his rationalizing them! - 06/01/2010 11:55:03 PM 894 Views
I do have to guiltily say, though, that if Rand had balefired the Seanchan and THEN became good... - 07/01/2010 12:03:20 AM 906 Views
*laughs behind hand* - 07/01/2010 12:05:54 AM 966 Views
Re: The worst part about his atrocities is his rationalizing them! - 07/01/2010 12:23:11 AM 831 Views
I don't think Rand or LTT (who has/have) little capacity for Healing - 07/01/2010 12:52:25 AM 857 Views
Re: I don't think Rand or LTT (who has/have) little capacity for Healing - 07/01/2010 01:24:32 AM 921 Views
Re: I don't think Rand or LTT (who has/have) little capacity for Healing - 07/01/2010 03:33:52 PM 854 Views
Re: I don't think Rand or LTT (who has/have) little capacity for Healing - 07/01/2010 04:28:18 PM 998 Views
right cause all Generals are so well versed in medical conditions - 07/01/2010 09:44:09 PM 957 Views
Nice way to avoid the argument. - 07/01/2010 10:00:17 PM 900 Views
I'm just done talking in circles. You seem to think that because people - 07/01/2010 11:53:05 PM 929 Views
I concede - 07/01/2010 01:09:11 AM 835 Views
You weren't wrong overall, but there were some serious flaws in your reasoning. - 07/01/2010 02:43:17 AM 964 Views
Tee hee. - 07/01/2010 05:28:52 AM 903 Views
Morals are subjective anyhow, - 07/01/2010 06:23:09 AM 920 Views
Re: Morals are subjective anyhow, - 07/01/2010 03:23:59 PM 842 Views
I have religious beliefs and that is an absurd contention - 09/01/2010 12:00:02 AM 917 Views
Re: I have religious beliefs and that is an absurd contention - 09/01/2010 05:56:16 PM 1093 Views
Re: I have religious beliefs and that is an absurd contention - 18/01/2010 01:00:23 PM 1222 Views
Your assertions weaken your overall argument. - 11/01/2010 04:47:10 PM 814 Views
Re: Your assertions weaken your overall argument. - 18/01/2010 12:49:26 PM 865 Views

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