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It's possible that this was mainly written by BS Etzel Send a noteboard - 26/01/2010 12:03:03 PM
However, I find it even more illogical, that Graendal basically wanted Rand to find her, so that he could balefire her palace and Graendal could fake her death, or how do you explain it then? It makes more sense that Graendal simply didn't think that Kerb would be found by Rand, or - if he were found - could help Rand, because of the strong Compulsion.
This message last edited by Etzel on 26/01/2010 at 12:03:28 PM
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Graendal's death would imply a major logical flaw in the story. fionwe1987 - 25/01/2010 05:18:23 PM 2755 Views
I think Graendal's death was a great scene Etzel - 25/01/2010 05:26:51 PM 1487 Views
The scene itself was great. The rest is crap. fionwe1987 - 25/01/2010 05:37:44 PM 1286 Views
After reading 12 WoT books... Etzel - 25/01/2010 05:46:31 PM 1386 Views
You also ignored... randfandom - 25/01/2010 08:15:34 PM 1398 Views
and of course, the obvious theme Sidious - 25/01/2010 09:02:56 PM 1209 Views
Bah! fionwe1987 - 25/01/2010 11:49:33 PM 1353 Views
It's possible that this was mainly written by BS Etzel - 26/01/2010 12:03:03 PM 1319 Views
I think playing too many games just messes up with the integrety and solidness of the books ... amirebram - 26/01/2010 09:46:16 PM 2781 Views
I agree that the set up for her death was rather lame darius_sedai - 25/01/2010 06:14:07 PM 1557 Views
I agree and have my own additional notes as to why I don't think she is dead. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 25/01/2010 06:18:30 PM 1347 Views
Re: I agree and have my own additional notes as to why I don't think she is dead. Underwood - 25/01/2010 06:44:34 PM 1282 Views
well one of her major character parallels is Josef Mengel darius_sedai - 25/01/2010 06:54:43 PM 1103 Views
Can you think of any way that would explain the Compulsion vanishing? beetnemesis - 25/01/2010 07:52:40 PM 1107 Views
that's kind of my whole point darius_sedai - 25/01/2010 08:43:19 PM 1032 Views
Uh, not actually at all really Sidious - 25/01/2010 09:07:52 PM 1336 Views
*shudders* Yondaime - 26/01/2010 02:27:35 AM 1206 Views
*shrugs* darius_sedai - 26/01/2010 08:47:21 AM 1238 Views
None of those "easy explanations" could work beetnemesis - 26/01/2010 07:14:16 AM 1144 Views
my entire problem with the scene is that it just felt too open ended darius_sedai - 26/01/2010 08:58:37 AM 1222 Views
Can't she knot it to disapate after being examined once? Rurouni_Kenshin - 26/01/2010 03:43:55 AM 1063 Views
Do we have evidence that this is possible? Yondaime - 26/01/2010 03:44:48 AM 1227 Views
why would Graendal do that anyway? Sidious - 26/01/2010 04:26:38 AM 1244 Views
Re: why would Graendal do that anyway? Rurouni_Kenshin - 03/02/2010 02:52:32 AM 1183 Views
Re: I agree and have my own additional notes as to why I don't think she is dead. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 26/01/2010 02:03:51 AM 1297 Views
I'm glad you think Be'lal is alive. Fanatic-Templar - 26/01/2010 07:38:40 AM 1050 Views
Re: I'm glad you think Be'lal is alive. darius_sedai - 26/01/2010 08:49:00 AM 1252 Views
Re: I'm glad you think Be'lal is alive. Lord Haart - 26/01/2010 09:19:35 AM 1032 Views
Moiraine probably learned it while researching with Adealas and Vandene. *NM* Gher - 26/01/2010 04:57:09 PM 852 Views
Sidious - 26/01/2010 11:42:04 AM 1233 Views
Didn't Balthamel and Aginor leave corpses? Fanatic-Templar - 26/01/2010 04:35:19 PM 1222 Views
Re: Didn't Balthamel and Aginor leave corpses? Sidious - 26/01/2010 07:06:01 PM 1099 Views
Re: RugbyPlayingAshaman - 26/01/2010 04:44:06 PM 1210 Views
He was balefired by a direct stream in front of at least two credible witnesses. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 26/01/2010 04:10:13 PM 1205 Views
Me, Too. The Name With No Man - 28/01/2010 08:00:09 PM 1204 Views
Re: I agree and have my own additional notes as to why I don't think she is dead. Sidious - 25/01/2010 08:56:16 PM 1319 Views
I believe she's dead Sareitha Sedai - 25/01/2010 09:06:37 PM 1153 Views
Re: I believe she's dead Sidious - 25/01/2010 09:09:58 PM 1200 Views
I don't think she would have taught anyone Sareitha Sedai - 25/01/2010 09:18:03 PM 1022 Views
Besides, if it wasn't Graendal, it implies that she knew of Rand's plan, which is not feasible *NM* Shannow - 26/01/2010 02:01:41 PM 639 Views
The compulsion did not disappear immediately. Read the damned scene! fionwe1987 - 25/01/2010 11:54:02 PM 1327 Views
Re: The compulsion did not disappear immediately. Read the damned scene! Underwood - 26/01/2010 01:22:57 AM 1077 Views
Stop passing judgments... fionwe1987 - 26/01/2010 02:05:21 AM 1263 Views
But your theories are becoming increasingly farfetched Sidious - 26/01/2010 04:21:21 AM 1139 Views
I repeat that I find her "death" monumental... fionwe1987 - 26/01/2010 07:16:13 PM 1115 Views
Re: I repeat that I find her "death" monumental... Sidious - 26/01/2010 07:23:29 PM 1143 Views
Dude, then you derailed the thread... fionwe1987 - 26/01/2010 07:31:55 PM 1047 Views
Not really Sidious - 26/01/2010 07:35:06 PM 1159 Views
Re: Not really fionwe1987 - 26/01/2010 07:45:20 PM 1227 Views
Re: Not really Sidious - 28/01/2010 04:27:17 PM 1144 Views
Re: Stop passing judgments... RugbyPlayingAshaman - 26/01/2010 04:40:37 PM 1108 Views
*NM* RugbyPlayingAshaman - 26/01/2010 05:00:10 PM 607 Views
Everyone can see residues- only a select few can "read" them beetnemesis - 26/01/2010 07:42:19 AM 1164 Views
no she said she wouldn't risk strength and skill in the same place darius_sedai - 26/01/2010 08:51:31 AM 1078 Views
Re: no she said she wouldn't risk strength and skill in the same place Sidious - 26/01/2010 11:37:26 AM 1204 Views
read the whole quote darius_sedai - 26/01/2010 04:35:17 PM 901 Views
LOL! You read the whole quote Sidious - 26/01/2010 07:00:41 PM 1012 Views
the risk she won't take is strength and skill residing together. darius_sedai - 27/01/2010 12:40:09 AM 1092 Views
Re: the risk she won't take is strength and skill residing together. Sidious - 28/01/2010 04:28:21 PM 1232 Views
I don't see any flaws. Skeeve the Great - 25/01/2010 09:14:44 PM 1266 Views
But... fionwe1987 - 25/01/2010 11:44:49 PM 1020 Views
Re: But... Skeeve the Great - 26/01/2010 01:14:51 AM 1159 Views
That is what I thought ... Yondaime - 26/01/2010 01:24:18 AM 1076 Views
That still doesn't make sense. fionwe1987 - 26/01/2010 02:23:12 AM 1252 Views
But, having a clean up guy does make sense. Yondaime - 26/01/2010 03:02:13 AM 1287 Views
But the clean up guy would require another clean up guy! fionwe1987 - 26/01/2010 03:35:44 AM 1137 Views
Re: But the clean up guy would require another clean up guy! Yondaime - 26/01/2010 04:12:41 AM 1069 Views
Nonsense. Fanatic-Templar - 26/01/2010 07:50:04 AM 1005 Views
Dude, read what I said please... fionwe1987 - 26/01/2010 07:21:52 PM 1190 Views
Re: Dude, read what I said please... Fanatic-Templar - 26/01/2010 09:28:25 PM 1173 Views
Kerb had no initiative... he was under too heavy a Compulsion to think for himself darius_sedai - 27/01/2010 12:45:47 AM 1058 Views
I think he had some, albeit probably not a whole lot Yondaime - 27/01/2010 01:03:44 AM 1111 Views
Nynaeve and Elayne were under a weaker compulsion... fionwe1987 - 27/01/2010 03:10:52 AM 932 Views
We don't know that, exactly Yondaime - 27/01/2010 03:50:44 AM 1002 Views
If you cannot provide an answer... fionwe1987 - 27/01/2010 03:10:40 AM 1080 Views
Seriously? Fanatic-Templar - 27/01/2010 03:55:57 AM 1107 Views
Maybe... Etzel - 27/01/2010 11:08:10 AM 1066 Views
Messenger was running around being obvious. Noone would suspect Kerb though. Case Closed. *NM* Lord Haart - 26/01/2010 11:08:16 AM 756 Views
Thank the creator you're not in the police then. *NM* fionwe1987 - 26/01/2010 07:22:29 PM 696 Views
Ok, in more detail: Lord Haart - 26/01/2010 08:16:30 PM 1180 Views
I'm tired of making this point... fionwe1987 - 26/01/2010 08:39:22 PM 926 Views
Re: I'm tired of making this point... Syraelle - 26/01/2010 08:44:51 PM 1105 Views
Thoughts Heiko - 26/01/2010 01:05:45 AM 1021 Views
But that means she's dead Skeeve the Great - 26/01/2010 01:20:19 AM 1063 Views
Re: But that means she's dead Heiko - 26/01/2010 05:31:25 AM 1158 Views
Nope. Ramshalan was just "collecting taxes" or something. Lord Haart - 26/01/2010 11:10:25 AM 997 Views
Re: Nope. Ramshalan was NOT just "collecting taxes" or something. Syraelle - 26/01/2010 05:41:17 PM 1070 Views
By, the way, if I understand this correctly... Fanatic-Templar - 26/01/2010 04:49:45 PM 1235 Views
Indeed... Etzel - 26/01/2010 05:13:53 PM 1244 Views
Re: Indeed... Sidious - 26/01/2010 07:04:40 PM 1066 Views
I'm not arguing she's alive, but... fionwe1987 - 26/01/2010 07:29:42 PM 1085 Views
Re: I'm not arguing she's alive, but... Underwood - 26/01/2010 07:58:41 PM 1080 Views
Re: I'm not arguing she's alive, but... Fanatic-Templar - 26/01/2010 09:42:52 PM 891 Views
Re: I'm not arguing she's alive, but... fionwe1987 - 27/01/2010 03:26:46 AM 1097 Views
Re: I'm not arguing she's alive, but... Fanatic-Templar - 27/01/2010 04:05:23 AM 1207 Views
That's not fair Yondaime - 27/01/2010 04:09:38 AM 1047 Views
I agree about the 'awesome' part . Fanatic-Templar - 27/01/2010 05:41:00 AM 1023 Views
Does anybody have a link to it? (nothing on Google). I'm intrigued. *NM* Lord Haart - 27/01/2010 08:27:13 AM 650 Views
It was on Wotmania. Someone copied all the theories, but I don't recall whom. *NM* Fanatic-Templar - 27/01/2010 08:31:00 AM 783 Views
I just think it's funny that what you call omniscience has been done by the Forsaken before. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 27/01/2010 02:02:44 PM 1019 Views
But Graendal was the victim of a greater plot. Lord Haart - 27/01/2010 05:30:28 PM 1129 Views
So your response is that Ishamael/Moridin is omniscient, not Graendal. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 27/01/2010 05:57:20 PM 1196 Views
Re: So your response is that Ishamael/Moridin is omniscient, not Graendal. Lord Haart - 28/01/2010 04:05:21 AM 1219 Views
Give me one example. Just one. *NM* Fanatic-Templar - 27/01/2010 06:52:44 PM 722 Views
Ishamael plans millennia ahead by sowing the seeds for the Black Ajah, the Seanchan and the current RugbyPlayingAshaman - 28/01/2010 01:57:39 PM 1197 Views
Not even comparable. Fanatic-Templar - 28/01/2010 06:31:06 PM 955 Views
Re: Not even comparable. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 28/01/2010 07:50:38 PM 1066 Views
Could you please take the effort to read my posts? Fanatic-Templar - 28/01/2010 10:45:01 PM 1020 Views
Re: Could you please take the effort to read my posts? RugbyPlayingAshaman - 29/01/2010 03:49:43 PM 1070 Views
Re: Could you please take the effort to read my posts? Fanatic-Templar - 29/01/2010 06:40:43 PM 1052 Views
And, just to double post: Fanatic-Templar - 27/01/2010 07:12:17 PM 838 Views
Re: And, just to double post: RugbyPlayingAshaman - 27/01/2010 08:25:45 PM 1116 Views
Nice answer. Fanatic-Templar - 28/01/2010 12:10:27 AM 1164 Views
Re: Nice answer. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 28/01/2010 01:55:16 PM 1094 Views
Hilarious. Fanatic-Templar - 28/01/2010 06:36:22 PM 1203 Views
Re: Hilarious. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 28/01/2010 07:15:20 PM 1090 Views
Re: Hilarious. Fanatic-Templar - 28/01/2010 07:41:29 PM 1105 Views
Re: Hilarious. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 28/01/2010 07:53:34 PM 955 Views
Re: Hilarious. Fanatic-Templar - 28/01/2010 10:55:57 PM 1140 Views
That's because you didn't look at other posts. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 29/01/2010 03:37:08 PM 1090 Views
Moridin's main directive was.. Etzel - 29/01/2010 03:57:41 PM 1123 Views
Re: Moridin's main directive was.. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 29/01/2010 04:50:16 PM 1164 Views
Preventing order wasn't accomplished... Etzel - 29/01/2010 05:12:22 PM 1134 Views
I disagree. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 29/01/2010 05:28:59 PM 1516 Views
I will stop our discussion here; the posts are already pushed too far to the right of my display. *NM* Etzel - 29/01/2010 06:14:29 PM 584 Views
You expect me to search every post you've made on this forum, ever? Fanatic-Templar - 29/01/2010 06:50:49 PM 1052 Views
Re: I'm not arguing she's alive, but... Skeeve the Great - 27/01/2010 01:00:42 AM 1072 Views
Re: I'm not arguing she's alive, but... fionwe1987 - 27/01/2010 03:26:56 AM 1123 Views
Re: I'm not arguing she's alive, but... Skeeve the Great - 27/01/2010 05:35:39 AM 1099 Views
I don't see a flaw rAndy aL - 27/01/2010 06:24:44 AM 1182 Views
Re: I don't see a flaw Underwood - 27/01/2010 04:18:27 PM 1129 Views
Yup, I'm tired of seeing arguments that ignore the need to back up their own claims. Lord Haart - 27/01/2010 05:47:16 PM 1096 Views
Let's give you one logic path for Millisair being poisoned. TheUltimateReality - 27/01/2010 05:47:04 PM 1123 Views
Spot on. *NM* Lord Haart - 28/01/2010 04:09:26 AM 715 Views
I don't think there's a flaw, I think you misinterpret Graendal's plans DomA - 27/01/2010 06:57:44 PM 1100 Views
Good point on Ituralde - he may still be Compulsed in ways we're yet to discover. *NM* Lord Haart - 28/01/2010 04:11:15 AM 695 Views
Compulsion is limited Sidious - 28/01/2010 04:30:24 PM 1080 Views
Re: Compulsion is limited Lord Haart - 28/01/2010 06:35:05 PM 1212 Views
Re: Compulsion is limited DomA - 28/01/2010 08:26:37 PM 989 Views
Re: Graendal's death would imply a major logical flaw in the story. taura-tierno - 27/01/2010 09:11:32 PM 1086 Views
There's really no further purpose for her character. Libby - 09/02/2010 10:52:58 PM 1165 Views
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