"Do you like it?" is about entertainment value and the strength of the story, not the strength of the actual execution. When people say that Jordan is "not a good writer" they usually mean exactly that - he doesn't write well. His story is fun and entertaining, but the actual mechanical execution, from any perspective (style, aesthetic value, word flow, strength of descriptions) is not stellar.
Since, as you noted, people differ in their tastes, a writer who can write well will almost always have supporters, so I don't think your point is really relevant (i.e., that a likable author can be good or bad, but an unlikable one can never be good). You yourself mentioned that likability is a subjective measure, so I can agree with you that the statement you made is true from a subjective perspective, but it doesn't affect the question of whether or not Jordan is a good writer.
I don't think Jordan cared about being a "good writer", though. He had mentioned over and over that the story was the most important point for him. The reason I feel it necessary to even comment in a post like this is because I think it's worthwhile combating two equally absurd viewpoints:
1. Irrational fans. These people think that, because they like the Wheel of Time, this means Jordan is the Charles Dickens, Fyodor Dostoevsky and Gustave Flaubert of the 1990s and 2000s. They try to elevate bad prose to the level of literature worthy of literary analysis and discussion.
2. Cretins. These people intentionally bash good literature because they themselves are incapable of appreciating it, and attempt to say that Jordan is better than traditional literature (in some dim way recognizing that Jordan is somehow "different" from literature as an art form) because they understand or appreciate Jordan but not serious literature.
I realize that neither group is going to be persuaded, the first because they are intentionally blind to criticism and the second because they are ignorant and uncultured, but there are other people who aren't in those categories who will still be swayed by arguments, and it's worth a bit of time to make sure the argument is made.
Since, as you noted, people differ in their tastes, a writer who can write well will almost always have supporters, so I don't think your point is really relevant (i.e., that a likable author can be good or bad, but an unlikable one can never be good). You yourself mentioned that likability is a subjective measure, so I can agree with you that the statement you made is true from a subjective perspective, but it doesn't affect the question of whether or not Jordan is a good writer.
I don't think Jordan cared about being a "good writer", though. He had mentioned over and over that the story was the most important point for him. The reason I feel it necessary to even comment in a post like this is because I think it's worthwhile combating two equally absurd viewpoints:
1. Irrational fans. These people think that, because they like the Wheel of Time, this means Jordan is the Charles Dickens, Fyodor Dostoevsky and Gustave Flaubert of the 1990s and 2000s. They try to elevate bad prose to the level of literature worthy of literary analysis and discussion.
2. Cretins. These people intentionally bash good literature because they themselves are incapable of appreciating it, and attempt to say that Jordan is better than traditional literature (in some dim way recognizing that Jordan is somehow "different" from literature as an art form) because they understand or appreciate Jordan but not serious literature.
I realize that neither group is going to be persuaded, the first because they are intentionally blind to criticism and the second because they are ignorant and uncultured, but there are other people who aren't in those categories who will still be swayed by arguments, and it's worth a bit of time to make sure the argument is made.
Political correctness is the pettiest form of casuistry.
ἡ δὲ κἀκ τριῶν τρυπημάτων ἐργαζομένη ἐνεκάλει τῇ φύσει, δυσφορουμένη, ὅτι δὴ μὴ καὶ τοὺς τιτθοὺς αὐτῇ εὐρύτερον ἢ νῦν εἰσι τρυπώη, ὅπως καὶ ἄλλην ἐνταῦθα μίξιν ἐπιτεχνᾶσθαι δυνατὴ εἴη. – Procopius
Ummaka qinnassa nīk!
*MySmiley*
ἡ δὲ κἀκ τριῶν τρυπημάτων ἐργαζομένη ἐνεκάλει τῇ φύσει, δυσφορουμένη, ὅτι δὴ μὴ καὶ τοὺς τιτθοὺς αὐτῇ εὐρύτερον ἢ νῦν εἰσι τρυπώη, ὅπως καὶ ἄλλην ἐνταῦθα μίξιν ἐπιτεχνᾶσθαι δυνατὴ εἴη. – Procopius
Ummaka qinnassa nīk!
*MySmiley*
Can someone explain to me how Jordan is not a particularly good writer?
- 21/02/2011 05:41:31 PM
3531 Views
I personally see it as more of RJ being a fantastic story teller, but not a well structured writer.
- 21/02/2011 06:44:21 PM
1961 Views
Re: I personally see it as more of RJ being a fantastic story teller, but not a well structured
- 22/02/2011 10:59:25 PM
1627 Views
What do you think about the Southern Gothic authors?
- 23/02/2011 08:08:26 AM
1455 Views
Re: What do you think about the Southern Gothic authors?
- 23/02/2011 10:51:57 AM
1533 Views
For the same reason that most people think they have above average intelligence.
- 21/02/2011 11:13:34 PM
1948 Views
Re: For the same reason that most people think they have above average intelligence. *NM*
- 22/02/2011 02:39:20 PM
1102 Views
Re: For the same reason that most people think they have above average intelligence.
- 22/02/2011 02:41:37 PM
1441 Views
That's possibly the best explanation of literary criticism I've ever seen.
- 23/02/2011 02:47:12 AM
1498 Views
I can take a shot at that, since nobody else seems willing to.
- 22/02/2011 07:29:20 AM
2019 Views
- 22/02/2011 07:29:20 AM
2019 Views
Re: I can take a shot at that, since nobody else seems willing to.
- 22/02/2011 11:23:38 PM
1652 Views
- 22/02/2011 11:23:38 PM
1652 Views
That has very little to do with anything unless you can provide a real-world analogy to a channeler.
- 22/02/2011 11:30:52 PM
1517 Views
Re: That has very little to do with anything unless you can provide a real-world analogy to a
- 23/02/2011 12:02:24 AM
1531 Views
As far as I'm concerned, the only way to gauge whether an author is good or not is ...
- 22/02/2011 03:58:17 PM
1566 Views
Re: Can someone explain to me how Jordan is not a particularly good writer?
- 22/02/2011 06:27:11 PM
2566 Views
I think it has more to do with limitations imposed by how the story was organized and edited.
- 22/02/2011 07:50:18 PM
1850 Views
That's interesting, and I have a weird agree/disagree here; also, that Adam Roberts sucks
- 23/02/2011 02:15:12 AM
1620 Views
Re: That's interesting, and I have a weird agree/disagree here; also, that Adam Roberts sucks
- 23/02/2011 11:02:14 AM
1565 Views
adam roberts reviews
- 23/02/2011 03:53:49 AM
1705 Views
And I suspect those who prefer the BS books are those who largely read WoT for the story. *NM*
- 23/02/2011 08:06:16 AM
964 Views
Oh GAWD!... not another pointer to Robert Adam's incoherant muckraking
- 24/02/2011 07:47:35 PM
1468 Views
I think DomA answered the question best, but the "do you like it" argument is weak.
- 22/02/2011 10:32:51 PM
1925 Views
Re: I think DomA answered the question best, but the "do you like it" argument is weak.
- 22/02/2011 11:16:24 PM
1800 Views
The Necronomicon isn't actually a book, you know.
*NM*
- 22/02/2011 11:28:29 PM
891 Views
*NM*
- 22/02/2011 11:28:29 PM
891 Views
There are nine, actually...
- 23/02/2011 12:04:55 AM
1747 Views
Lovecraft's Necronomicon was fictitious. If you want to count fanfiction, fine. *NM*
- 23/02/2011 12:38:07 AM
968 Views
Based on how poorly worded that response was, I'm not sure what to think of it. *NM*
- 23/02/2011 12:13:00 AM
974 Views
I hope I am misunderstanding you.
- 23/02/2011 10:57:47 PM
1394 Views
Re: I hope I am misunderstanding you.
- 24/02/2011 10:41:09 AM
1555 Views
If the core of the story is all that matters, why read a book
- 24/02/2011 10:32:01 PM
1501 Views
Re: If the core of the story is all that matters, why read a book
- 24/02/2011 11:23:42 PM
1512 Views
So wait, style is good?
- 25/02/2011 12:32:07 AM
1788 Views
That depends...
- 23/02/2011 03:00:35 AM
1691 Views
I didn't say aesthetics was the primary criterion. I named three criteria.
- 23/02/2011 05:39:03 AM
1560 Views
the "do you like it" is the most important criterion
- 23/02/2011 10:45:17 PM
1521 Views
Not for quality of writing.
- 24/02/2011 05:17:52 PM
1492 Views
If you don't mind me asking...
- 24/02/2011 01:05:12 AM
1481 Views
I don't mind that you ask, but I'm not going to engage in a defense of literature.
- 24/02/2011 05:35:27 PM
1419 Views
Re: I don't mind that you ask, but I'm not going to engage in a defense of literature.
- 24/02/2011 11:26:55 PM
1479 Views
I'm sure you have a wonderful job awaiting in fast food service.
- 25/02/2011 01:57:15 AM
1543 Views
Re: I'm sure you have a wonderful job awaiting in fast food service.
- 25/02/2011 08:56:06 AM
1488 Views
...
- 25/02/2011 01:07:22 AM
1385 Views
It is not a serious question.
- 25/02/2011 01:53:59 AM
1552 Views
Is that so?
- 25/02/2011 05:58:31 AM
1709 Views
I'm not fixated with Jordan.
- 25/02/2011 03:13:56 PM
1495 Views
Then why do you keep trying to qualify the passage in relation to him?
- 25/02/2011 06:29:31 PM
1532 Views
You're conflating two things.
- 25/02/2011 07:32:59 PM
1656 Views
All right, now we're getting somewhere.
- 26/02/2011 12:40:57 AM
1515 Views
Okay, here you go. I am giving you the benefit of the doubt as to your sincerity.
- 26/02/2011 03:20:44 PM
1345 Views
Thank you, and I agree with all your explanations. *NM*
- 26/02/2011 07:28:09 PM
859 Views
No, it is a serious question, just one that can never be seriously answered.
- 25/02/2011 03:28:48 PM
1554 Views
Your opinion isn't as valid as anyone else's if that's your opinion.
- 25/02/2011 04:44:57 PM
1646 Views
Re: Your opinion isn't as valid as anyone else's if that's your opinion.
- 25/02/2011 06:05:18 PM
1968 Views
I'm not wasting my time proving something to an internet moron and troll like you.
- 25/02/2011 07:36:19 PM
1380 Views
Ah yes, the wonderful "dissmiss the person who disagrees with me by insulting him tactic"
- 28/02/2011 02:30:35 PM
1369 Views
Re: Your opinion isn't as valid as anyone else's if that's your opinion.
- 26/02/2011 11:06:26 AM
1365 Views
Re: I find this whole thing elitist and more than a bit silly
- 23/02/2011 06:45:05 AM
1713 Views
Why do you think mind-expanding literature is restricted to the classics?
- 23/02/2011 08:03:59 AM
1392 Views
Re: Why do you think mind-expanding literature is restricted to the classics?
- 23/02/2011 09:25:10 AM
1557 Views
Of course people read for pleasure.
- 23/02/2011 09:04:24 PM
1429 Views
Ok...
- 24/02/2011 08:59:27 AM
1427 Views
"Yeah well, that's, like, just your opinion, man." Good argument.
- 24/02/2011 03:43:24 PM
1537 Views
I'm curious to hear who Tom and DomA consider a "very good writer"?
- 24/02/2011 05:49:13 PM
1542 Views
Among living writers?
- 24/02/2011 08:16:08 PM
1595 Views
My list would be similar...
- 26/02/2011 07:24:11 AM
1705 Views
That was a very good list.
- 26/02/2011 03:07:31 PM
1634 Views
Re: That was a very good list.
- 27/02/2011 04:51:43 AM
1604 Views
Oh, and another question
- 27/02/2011 05:28:47 PM
1262 Views
Re: Oh, and another question
- 01/03/2011 03:42:02 AM
1549 Views
I think the two of you have taken too narrow a meaning of 'great'
- 27/02/2011 11:14:30 AM
1711 Views
Re: I think the two of you have taken too narrow a meaning of 'great'
- 28/02/2011 11:51:49 PM
1608 Views
Re: I think the two of you have taken too narrow a meaning of 'great'
- 03/03/2011 12:01:30 AM
1603 Views
Re: I think the two of you have taken too narrow a meaning of 'great'
- 03/03/2011 02:17:06 PM
1519 Views
He's a great storyteller, but his prose is somewhat uninspiring. *NM*
- 27/02/2011 07:28:00 PM
988 Views

*NM*