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I concede Datakim Send a noteboard - 07/01/2010 01:09:11 AM
Well. I was reading the book trying to come up with another argument for Fanatic-Templar, and I just realised something. I think I totally messed everything up here.

My original idea was based on two fronts.

1. Rand was right that the people that Graendal had compulsed were so braindead that for all intents and purposes they were not alive at all and the only one truly alive there was Graendal. The rest were zombies. I think that this still has merit.

2. LTT/Rand was still sane enough at the point the balefiring happened that he would have been carefull to use a minimum amount of force. If there was a chance to destroy the pattern, he would not have done it. And also that having LTT memories would mean that he would know exactly how much damage the pattern could take, better than anyone. So essentially no balefire atrocity.

However, upon re-reading the book, I just realised that the balefire incident happened a lot later in the books than I thought it did. I thought it happened relatively early, before Rand started agreeing with LTT that death was preferable. It did not. It happened very near the end.

This causes the floor to drop entirely from my argument. There is no reason to assume that the totally suicidal Rand that he already is at this point would be especially carefull with Balefire. He is more Moridin than TwoRivers!Rand already.

So I admit, I was probably wrong about the whole balefire thing and that those who argued with me about that are right and that it was indeed a crazy atrocity.

Damnit.
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Rand the psycho? - 06/01/2010 02:53:30 AM 1597 Views
I cannot follow your assumptions. - 06/01/2010 04:07:33 AM 994 Views
On Balefire - 06/01/2010 04:43:18 AM 995 Views
Good point - 06/01/2010 05:04:26 AM 1021 Views
On the nature of BaleFire - 06/01/2010 03:32:25 PM 924 Views
Re: I cannot follow your assumptions. - 06/01/2010 04:59:12 AM 831 Views
Wait! - 06/01/2010 05:10:33 AM 954 Views
Re: Wait! - 06/01/2010 05:20:02 AM 867 Views
Re: Wait! - 06/01/2010 05:58:00 AM 836 Views
Re: Wait! - 06/01/2010 11:46:13 AM 789 Views
Re: Wait! - 06/01/2010 03:55:01 PM 787 Views
I disagree - 06/01/2010 05:42:44 PM 747 Views
Re: I disagree - 06/01/2010 06:41:08 PM 772 Views
Re: I disagree - 07/01/2010 04:42:40 AM 753 Views
I doubt he meant 'in one go' as a single stream of balefire. - 06/01/2010 07:30:56 AM 910 Views
Re: I doubt he meant 'in one go' as a single stream of balefire. - 06/01/2010 03:32:24 PM 817 Views
Re: I doubt he meant 'in one go' as a single stream of balefire. - 06/01/2010 09:52:47 PM 881 Views
Re: I doubt he meant 'in one go' as a single stream of balefire. - 06/01/2010 11:19:56 PM 761 Views
Re: I doubt he meant 'in one go' as a single stream of balefire. - 07/01/2010 12:21:50 AM 854 Views
Re: I doubt he meant 'in one go' as a single stream of balefire. - 07/01/2010 12:56:26 AM 792 Views
Re: I doubt he meant 'in one go' as a single stream of balefire. - 07/01/2010 01:46:16 AM 808 Views
I agree with Templar - 09/01/2010 04:36:20 PM 776 Views
Re: I cannot follow your assumptions. - 06/01/2010 07:57:54 AM 890 Views
Rand crossed a line - 06/01/2010 02:36:42 PM 903 Views
Re: Rand crossed a line - 06/01/2010 04:16:12 PM 816 Views
But... - 06/01/2010 04:34:02 PM 929 Views
Re: But... - 06/01/2010 06:14:25 PM 741 Views
Doesn't Balefire remove your thread from the Pattern permanently? - 06/01/2010 02:55:38 PM 802 Views
No, RJ stated balefired people can be reborn. *NM* - 06/01/2010 03:26:00 PM 412 Views
But not in this turning of the Wheel. So they'd miss out on MANY lifetimes. - 06/01/2010 05:46:04 PM 807 Views
What? - 06/01/2010 06:20:56 PM 813 Views
Where did you get that? - 06/01/2010 07:09:38 PM 776 Views
No, balefire just kills you backwards in time. It is not super-death. *NM* - 06/01/2010 09:58:18 PM 449 Views
LOL ... super-death! - 06/01/2010 11:59:31 PM 756 Views
Hah! *NM* - 07/01/2010 12:06:07 AM 395 Views
It makes me think of History of the World Part 1 - 07/01/2010 12:53:20 AM 766 Views
It makes me think of History of the World Part 1 - 07/01/2010 12:53:33 AM 737 Views
Yes it was. - 06/01/2010 06:51:15 PM 872 Views
Re: Yes it was. - 06/01/2010 07:16:14 PM 795 Views
Re: Yes it was. - 06/01/2010 08:58:40 PM 832 Views
Re: Yes it was. - 06/01/2010 10:47:11 PM 824 Views
let me ask the question in a different way - 06/01/2010 11:26:43 PM 811 Views
Re: let me ask the question in a different way - 06/01/2010 11:40:56 PM 810 Views
actually that quote supports my thoughts - 06/01/2010 11:50:40 PM 828 Views
Re: actually that quote supports my thoughts - 07/01/2010 12:10:07 AM 785 Views
Meh. I just think advocating mass-murder is the opposite direction RJ meant for this to take. - 07/01/2010 12:00:44 AM 840 Views
Sigh. What mass murder? - 07/01/2010 12:15:01 AM 726 Views
you are kidding right? - 07/01/2010 12:19:58 AM 816 Views
In this book Rand was a wimp and a bully. - 07/01/2010 03:14:32 PM 800 Views
Re: In this book Rand was a wimp and a bully. - 07/01/2010 03:57:43 PM 808 Views
Re: In this book Rand was a wimp and a bully. - 07/01/2010 07:13:21 PM 820 Views
Re: In this book Rand was a wimp and a bully. - 07/01/2010 07:52:24 PM 764 Views
Re: In this book Rand was a wimp and a bully. - 07/01/2010 08:56:43 PM 834 Views
Re: In this book Rand was a wimp and a bully. - 07/01/2010 09:26:01 PM 765 Views
Re: In this book Rand was a wimp and a bully. - 07/01/2010 09:30:45 PM 709 Views
Personally I'm kind of sick of Rand being the only person killing FS! - 07/01/2010 09:42:57 PM 887 Views
Re: In this book Rand was a wimp and a bully. - 07/01/2010 09:56:02 PM 822 Views
OK I'm sorry but this gets a huge ROFL :lol: - 07/01/2010 10:30:19 PM 798 Views
Re: OK I'm sorry but this gets a huge ROFL :lol: - 08/01/2010 01:53:25 PM 752 Views
Re: OK I'm sorry but this gets a huge ROFL :lol: - 08/01/2010 02:56:41 PM 811 Views
What might work... - 08/01/2010 12:35:17 PM 721 Views
Re: What might work... - 08/01/2010 11:38:09 PM 743 Views
Yes. Anakin Skywalker all over again - 06/01/2010 11:01:02 PM 896 Views
Meh - 06/01/2010 11:30:24 PM 742 Views
The worst part about his atrocities is his rationalizing them! - 06/01/2010 11:33:32 PM 747 Views
Re: The worst part about his atrocities is his rationalizing them! - 06/01/2010 11:50:37 PM 826 Views
Re: The worst part about his atrocities is his rationalizing them! - 06/01/2010 11:55:03 PM 769 Views
I do have to guiltily say, though, that if Rand had balefired the Seanchan and THEN became good... - 07/01/2010 12:03:20 AM 803 Views
*laughs behind hand* - 07/01/2010 12:05:54 AM 879 Views
Re: The worst part about his atrocities is his rationalizing them! - 07/01/2010 12:23:11 AM 745 Views
I don't think Rand or LTT (who has/have) little capacity for Healing - 07/01/2010 12:52:25 AM 752 Views
Re: I don't think Rand or LTT (who has/have) little capacity for Healing - 07/01/2010 01:24:32 AM 816 Views
Re: I don't think Rand or LTT (who has/have) little capacity for Healing - 07/01/2010 03:33:52 PM 756 Views
Re: I don't think Rand or LTT (who has/have) little capacity for Healing - 07/01/2010 04:28:18 PM 900 Views
right cause all Generals are so well versed in medical conditions - 07/01/2010 09:44:09 PM 854 Views
Nice way to avoid the argument. - 07/01/2010 10:00:17 PM 810 Views
I'm just done talking in circles. You seem to think that because people - 07/01/2010 11:53:05 PM 842 Views
I concede - 07/01/2010 01:09:11 AM 736 Views
You weren't wrong overall, but there were some serious flaws in your reasoning. - 07/01/2010 02:43:17 AM 845 Views
Tee hee. - 07/01/2010 05:28:52 AM 794 Views
Morals are subjective anyhow, - 07/01/2010 06:23:09 AM 830 Views
Re: Morals are subjective anyhow, - 07/01/2010 03:23:59 PM 751 Views
I have religious beliefs and that is an absurd contention - 09/01/2010 12:00:02 AM 827 Views
Re: I have religious beliefs and that is an absurd contention - 09/01/2010 05:56:16 PM 983 Views
Re: I have religious beliefs and that is an absurd contention - 18/01/2010 01:00:23 PM 1094 Views
Your assertions weaken your overall argument. - 11/01/2010 04:47:10 PM 722 Views
Re: Your assertions weaken your overall argument. - 18/01/2010 12:49:26 PM 762 Views

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