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Re: I disagree Lord Haart Send a noteboard - 07/01/2010 04:42:40 AM
Given that, and given that he knows that the timespan he burned Rahvin back was sufficient since Moridin told him that Rahvin was gone. And given that he has not had his breakdown yet and does not want to destroy the pattern, why would he burn Graendal back any more than he did Rahvin? I see no reason why he would.

I think what we saw was a wide balefire stream that had been attuned so that while it touched everyone, those that it touched were not burned back all that long. No more than Rahvin and probably less. He might even have used as little as what Moiraine used when he took out Bel'al.


Actually, we DO know that Graendal was burned back at LEAST 15 minutes or so. There had to be enough time for Ramshalan to get Compulsed, return to Rand, be delved for Compulsion, and then for Rand to act. Given that they were a fair way from Natrin's Barrow, and that Ramshalan would take time to find his way out, I'd say an estimate of 30 minutes is reasonable. And this is the MINIMUM balefire strength - Rand could have used more for all we know, but any less and the Compulsion would not have been removed.

Based on this, we know the strength of the balefire was similar to that used on Rahvin (ie, Rand's total strength). Couple that with the area affected:

1km squared = 1 million metres squared.


and we see that

This strongly suggests that he is definitely drawing deeply on the Choedan Kal.


Because we have to assume that the Balefire was equally strong at all points (Rand didn't know where in Natrin's Barrow Graendal was, and he had to hit her hard enough that he would get the confirmation of her death from the removal of Ramshalan's Compulsion).

1 million times Rand's own strength is certainly a massive boost, no matter how you look at it. Even if we assume that Natrin's Barrow is only 250m squared, that's still 62,500 times Rand's unaided strength.

So in answer to your argument, we do definitively know that the balefire was of substantial strength, and therefore covering a large area of it was a dangerous act.
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Rand the psycho? - 06/01/2010 02:53:30 AM 1939 Views
I cannot follow your assumptions. - 06/01/2010 04:07:33 AM 1406 Views
On Balefire - 06/01/2010 04:43:18 AM 1347 Views
Good point - 06/01/2010 05:04:26 AM 1387 Views
On the nature of BaleFire - 06/01/2010 03:32:25 PM 1284 Views
Re: I cannot follow your assumptions. - 06/01/2010 04:59:12 AM 1195 Views
Wait! - 06/01/2010 05:10:33 AM 1282 Views
Re: Wait! - 06/01/2010 05:20:02 AM 1184 Views
Re: Wait! - 06/01/2010 05:58:00 AM 1170 Views
Re: Wait! - 06/01/2010 11:46:13 AM 1139 Views
Re: Wait! - 06/01/2010 03:55:01 PM 1142 Views
I disagree - 06/01/2010 05:42:44 PM 1110 Views
Re: I disagree - 06/01/2010 06:41:08 PM 1135 Views
Re: I disagree - 07/01/2010 04:42:40 AM 1129 Views
I doubt he meant 'in one go' as a single stream of balefire. - 06/01/2010 07:30:56 AM 1233 Views
Re: I doubt he meant 'in one go' as a single stream of balefire. - 06/01/2010 03:32:24 PM 1156 Views
Re: I doubt he meant 'in one go' as a single stream of balefire. - 06/01/2010 09:52:47 PM 1244 Views
Re: I doubt he meant 'in one go' as a single stream of balefire. - 06/01/2010 11:19:56 PM 1196 Views
Re: I doubt he meant 'in one go' as a single stream of balefire. - 07/01/2010 12:21:50 AM 1212 Views
Re: I doubt he meant 'in one go' as a single stream of balefire. - 07/01/2010 12:56:26 AM 1141 Views
Re: I doubt he meant 'in one go' as a single stream of balefire. - 07/01/2010 01:46:16 AM 1216 Views
I agree with Templar - 09/01/2010 04:36:20 PM 1115 Views
Re: I cannot follow your assumptions. - 06/01/2010 07:57:54 AM 1236 Views
Rand crossed a line - 06/01/2010 02:36:42 PM 1242 Views
Re: Rand crossed a line - 06/01/2010 04:16:12 PM 1189 Views
But... - 06/01/2010 04:34:02 PM 1265 Views
Re: But... - 06/01/2010 06:14:25 PM 1082 Views
Doesn't Balefire remove your thread from the Pattern permanently? - 06/01/2010 02:55:38 PM 1269 Views
No, RJ stated balefired people can be reborn. *NM* - 06/01/2010 03:26:00 PM 605 Views
But not in this turning of the Wheel. So they'd miss out on MANY lifetimes. - 06/01/2010 05:46:04 PM 1145 Views
What? - 06/01/2010 06:20:56 PM 1143 Views
Where did you get that? - 06/01/2010 07:09:38 PM 1110 Views
No, balefire just kills you backwards in time. It is not super-death. *NM* - 06/01/2010 09:58:18 PM 609 Views
LOL ... super-death! - 06/01/2010 11:59:31 PM 1084 Views
Hah! *NM* - 07/01/2010 12:06:07 AM 605 Views
It makes me think of History of the World Part 1 - 07/01/2010 12:53:20 AM 1126 Views
It makes me think of History of the World Part 1 - 07/01/2010 12:53:33 AM 1061 Views
Yes it was. - 06/01/2010 06:51:15 PM 1227 Views
Re: Yes it was. - 06/01/2010 07:16:14 PM 1197 Views
Re: Yes it was. - 06/01/2010 08:58:40 PM 1177 Views
Re: Yes it was. - 06/01/2010 10:47:11 PM 1171 Views
let me ask the question in a different way - 06/01/2010 11:26:43 PM 1185 Views
Re: let me ask the question in a different way - 06/01/2010 11:40:56 PM 1154 Views
actually that quote supports my thoughts - 06/01/2010 11:50:40 PM 1284 Views
Re: actually that quote supports my thoughts - 07/01/2010 12:10:07 AM 1110 Views
Meh. I just think advocating mass-murder is the opposite direction RJ meant for this to take. - 07/01/2010 12:00:44 AM 1260 Views
Sigh. What mass murder? - 07/01/2010 12:15:01 AM 1106 Views
you are kidding right? - 07/01/2010 12:19:58 AM 1162 Views
In this book Rand was a wimp and a bully. - 07/01/2010 03:14:32 PM 1130 Views
Re: In this book Rand was a wimp and a bully. - 07/01/2010 03:57:43 PM 1143 Views
Re: In this book Rand was a wimp and a bully. - 07/01/2010 07:13:21 PM 1161 Views
Re: In this book Rand was a wimp and a bully. - 07/01/2010 07:52:24 PM 1097 Views
Re: In this book Rand was a wimp and a bully. - 07/01/2010 08:56:43 PM 1176 Views
Re: In this book Rand was a wimp and a bully. - 07/01/2010 09:26:01 PM 1138 Views
Re: In this book Rand was a wimp and a bully. - 07/01/2010 09:30:45 PM 1058 Views
Personally I'm kind of sick of Rand being the only person killing FS! - 07/01/2010 09:42:57 PM 1208 Views
Re: In this book Rand was a wimp and a bully. - 07/01/2010 09:56:02 PM 1193 Views
OK I'm sorry but this gets a huge ROFL :lol: - 07/01/2010 10:30:19 PM 1202 Views
Re: OK I'm sorry but this gets a huge ROFL :lol: - 08/01/2010 01:53:25 PM 1099 Views
Re: OK I'm sorry but this gets a huge ROFL :lol: - 08/01/2010 02:56:41 PM 1157 Views
What might work... - 08/01/2010 12:35:17 PM 1045 Views
Re: What might work... - 08/01/2010 11:38:09 PM 1068 Views
Yes. Anakin Skywalker all over again - 06/01/2010 11:01:02 PM 1249 Views
Meh - 06/01/2010 11:30:24 PM 1099 Views
The worst part about his atrocities is his rationalizing them! - 06/01/2010 11:33:32 PM 1076 Views
Re: The worst part about his atrocities is his rationalizing them! - 06/01/2010 11:50:37 PM 1179 Views
Re: The worst part about his atrocities is his rationalizing them! - 06/01/2010 11:55:03 PM 1147 Views
I do have to guiltily say, though, that if Rand had balefired the Seanchan and THEN became good... - 07/01/2010 12:03:20 AM 1136 Views
*laughs behind hand* - 07/01/2010 12:05:54 AM 1204 Views
Re: The worst part about his atrocities is his rationalizing them! - 07/01/2010 12:23:11 AM 1060 Views
I don't think Rand or LTT (who has/have) little capacity for Healing - 07/01/2010 12:52:25 AM 1106 Views
Re: I don't think Rand or LTT (who has/have) little capacity for Healing - 07/01/2010 01:24:32 AM 1198 Views
Re: I don't think Rand or LTT (who has/have) little capacity for Healing - 07/01/2010 03:33:52 PM 1090 Views
Re: I don't think Rand or LTT (who has/have) little capacity for Healing - 07/01/2010 04:28:18 PM 1255 Views
right cause all Generals are so well versed in medical conditions - 07/01/2010 09:44:09 PM 1206 Views
Nice way to avoid the argument. - 07/01/2010 10:00:17 PM 1134 Views
I'm just done talking in circles. You seem to think that because people - 07/01/2010 11:53:05 PM 1194 Views
I concede - 07/01/2010 01:09:11 AM 1091 Views
You weren't wrong overall, but there were some serious flaws in your reasoning. - 07/01/2010 02:43:17 AM 1211 Views
Tee hee. - 07/01/2010 05:28:52 AM 1165 Views
Morals are subjective anyhow, - 07/01/2010 06:23:09 AM 1157 Views
Re: Morals are subjective anyhow, - 07/01/2010 03:23:59 PM 1109 Views
I have religious beliefs and that is an absurd contention - 09/01/2010 12:00:02 AM 1160 Views
Re: I have religious beliefs and that is an absurd contention - 09/01/2010 05:56:16 PM 1348 Views
Re: I have religious beliefs and that is an absurd contention - 18/01/2010 01:00:23 PM 1470 Views
Your assertions weaken your overall argument. - 11/01/2010 04:47:10 PM 1045 Views
Re: Your assertions weaken your overall argument. - 18/01/2010 12:49:26 PM 1092 Views

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