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Hmmm.... Sidious Send a noteboard - 23/01/2016 03:06:15 PM

I think Fionwe might be right on this one, if I've read the debate correctly.

It seems like all shields are the same in the series. Lanfear calls a shield a shield, and if there is any weave that passed down through the ages it would be that. Shields are always described in the same way - if they are very strong then the person describes them as a glass wall, and if they are weaker they bend.

The quote with Liandrin/Moghedien clearly represents the knot. The fact that Liandrin can identify it as a shield implies that shields are the same. We have seen Nynaeve unable to decipher what Moghedien is weaving as a counter example. We've also seen SH remove the Source from the FS, and they know it's not shielding.

Liandrin then goes on saying that the complexity of the knot is horrific and she loses sight of it. Moghedien says only the FS can unravel it - it's clearly about the knot and the not the technique. We've seen Osan'gar I think say that he could unravel any shield with time, so that goes against the technique and more about the knot being the way past shielding.

If you sharpen the edges of the shield you sever the person. That much is made clear with Nynaeve's duel with Moghedien. We also know that Asmodean severed his mother so it's likely Nynaeve's claim about this subject is not dubious and it can be done by an individual.

Berowin says that she has 'honed her skills over time'. I think she does the exact opposite. I think she makes her weaves blunt and soft, and they bend like elastic bands. It is similar to Rand encountering soft spots when the AS held him and him saying that they can't be broken. This of course takes time and practice to master.

If Berowin tied off her shield then Rand would probably be able to break it, but only by unravelling the knot. Her weave per se is invincible due to its durability. Moghedien's trick would not work on Rand or other educated channelers. You can unravel a horrible knot, it just takes time. Heaven knows how long - maybe Rand would need hours or days on Liandrin's weave? This is obviously why Rand didn't shield Semirhage and perform a complex knot - he knows she'll eventually escape.

Lanfear's shield on Asmodean is a partial shield. It's identical to hiding your ability and partially hiding your ability like Mesaana did, in a way. His shield is probably difficult to break because he can't cause that gradient between himself and the True Source, and as she said, there is obviously some pain involved, though I'm not sure what this is because we've never seen similar 'pain'. It's possible he needs to try and draw his maximum but because of the partial shield it feels like overdrawing, and thus the extreme pain of overdrawing. The shield will eventually buckle but he won't subject himself to this. It's also likely she lied about the shield dissipating.

It seems like there are only two real types of shields in the story - shields for men and women. Rand himself said he couldn't remember how to shield a woman, so the technique is probably different. If you sharpen the edges with skill or a circle you can sever someone.

Wheel of Time board admin
Fan of Lanfear
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Angreal, Sa'angreal and Moiraine at 66 - 11/01/2016 08:53:23 AM 1896 Views
Or we can choose to assume Elayne is incorrect - 11/01/2016 03:50:14 PM 909 Views
Uhhh... - 12/01/2016 12:07:42 AM 1015 Views
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Would you consider... - 17/01/2016 09:06:59 AM 837 Views
random thought on Shielding - 19/01/2016 07:34:20 PM 903 Views
You're forgetting the other side, though. - 19/01/2016 08:19:59 PM 965 Views
yes but it doesn't proactively do this - 19/01/2016 10:06:25 PM 839 Views
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Not the crux of the debate... - 21/01/2016 03:37:40 AM 856 Views
Not really though - 21/01/2016 05:00:34 PM 630 Views
I always explained it as - 21/01/2016 09:26:35 PM 851 Views
There's not much to go on since all the shields except Berowyn's are the same - 21/01/2016 09:55:14 PM 737 Views
That's precisely my point - 21/01/2016 10:09:02 PM 872 Views
now you are speculating based on a lack of evidence - 21/01/2016 10:39:13 PM 710 Views
There's actual evidence: - 22/01/2016 06:25:25 AM 891 Views
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Whoa.. - 22/01/2016 04:24:19 PM 962 Views
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Wonderful - 22/01/2016 06:30:35 PM 885 Views
yup that's my argument. that and you're a dick so I'm done with this - 22/01/2016 06:46:23 PM 708 Views
Re: yup that's my argument. that and you're a dick so I'm done with this - 23/01/2016 02:35:33 PM 958 Views
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Hmmm.... - 23/01/2016 03:06:15 PM 909 Views
Let me clear this up - 25/01/2016 04:19:51 PM 1087 Views
Some more quotes - 25/01/2016 05:10:51 PM 847 Views
none of which I've denied or tried to prove otherwise - 25/01/2016 07:19:48 PM 1150 Views
Re: none of which I've denied or tried to prove otherwise - 26/01/2016 03:45:52 AM 916 Views
Re: none of which I've denied or tried to prove otherwise - 26/01/2016 09:00:55 AM 1019 Views
Re: none of which I've denied or tried to prove otherwise - 26/01/2016 10:39:49 AM 846 Views
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Huh? - 20/01/2016 06:01:04 AM 806 Views
agree to disagree I suppose ... I don't see it this way *NM* - 20/01/2016 04:41:16 PM 431 Views
I didn't sense disagreement so much as confusion over my position. *NM* - 21/01/2016 12:01:16 AM 411 Views
Re: I didn't sense disagreement so much as confusion over my position. - 21/01/2016 02:07:21 AM 735 Views
Re: I didn't sense disagreement so much as confusion over my position. - 21/01/2016 03:32:59 AM 755 Views
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Re: I don't see how magnifiers solve this - 21/01/2016 10:16:16 PM 754 Views
Uhhh... - 22/01/2016 06:51:11 AM 901 Views
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The very first chapter (the Prologue) disproves this - 03/10/2016 06:56:28 AM 698 Views
No it doesn't - 05/10/2016 12:47:03 AM 603 Views
Re: Don't those two facts explain each other? - 08/10/2016 05:06:53 AM 481 Views
Re: Yes, but that's not what I'm arguing... - 08/10/2016 04:52:06 AM 713 Views

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