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Re: Morals are subjective anyhow, RugbyPlayingAshaman Send a noteboard - 07/01/2010 03:23:59 PM
A couple hundred people is nothing, look at wars in the real world many more than a few hundred civilians die.


And that is how the slippery slope begins. These types of things tend to start with that line of reasoning, with the line of reasoning escalating. If I was a more religious person, I could argue that in the real world, we aren't talking about souls but physical bodies, and as terrible as mass murder is their souls would still be saved by a God somewhere. What Rand did was demolish those souls with little understanding if those would ever come back - judging from the behavior of him and his companions they all assumed that those souls were gone forever, and I think it's unfortunate that so many of the arguments here bring in RJ's statement to justify it. If President Bush had decided to nuke Afghanistan and Iraq saying that the souls would be reborn in another few generations, we'd call him insane, yet in the bounds of this fictional world there are too many people IMO willing to concede that this is rational. It was not a rational act. It was the act of the madman and power mad tyrant that Rand stood on the threshhold of becoming.

We actually saw this slipper slope escalate in the books: After balefiring the hundreds of people at Graendals' palace, Rand later threatens to rain fire using the Choedan Kal on the Borderlander army which consisted of thousands of people, and later even then he considers to wipe out the headquarters of the Seanchan incursion with balefire - that is a population that dwarfed what was in Graendal's place.

The problem with rationalizing these types of things is that you lose your humanity by denying that other people have a valid right to existence.
"Those who think they have no time for bodily exercise will sooner or later have to find time for illness."
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Rand the psycho? - 06/01/2010 02:53:30 AM 1741 Views
I cannot follow your assumptions. - 06/01/2010 04:07:33 AM 1151 Views
On Balefire - 06/01/2010 04:43:18 AM 1150 Views
Good point - 06/01/2010 05:04:26 AM 1158 Views
On the nature of BaleFire - 06/01/2010 03:32:25 PM 1079 Views
Re: I cannot follow your assumptions. - 06/01/2010 04:59:12 AM 972 Views
Wait! - 06/01/2010 05:10:33 AM 1073 Views
Re: Wait! - 06/01/2010 05:20:02 AM 978 Views
Re: Wait! - 06/01/2010 05:58:00 AM 967 Views
Re: Wait! - 06/01/2010 11:46:13 AM 928 Views
Re: Wait! - 06/01/2010 03:55:01 PM 937 Views
I disagree - 06/01/2010 05:42:44 PM 894 Views
Re: I disagree - 06/01/2010 06:41:08 PM 920 Views
Re: I disagree - 07/01/2010 04:42:40 AM 911 Views
I doubt he meant 'in one go' as a single stream of balefire. - 06/01/2010 07:30:56 AM 1035 Views
Re: I doubt he meant 'in one go' as a single stream of balefire. - 06/01/2010 03:32:24 PM 933 Views
Re: I doubt he meant 'in one go' as a single stream of balefire. - 06/01/2010 09:52:47 PM 1034 Views
Re: I doubt he meant 'in one go' as a single stream of balefire. - 06/01/2010 11:19:56 PM 952 Views
Re: I doubt he meant 'in one go' as a single stream of balefire. - 07/01/2010 12:21:50 AM 1007 Views
Re: I doubt he meant 'in one go' as a single stream of balefire. - 07/01/2010 12:56:26 AM 951 Views
Re: I doubt he meant 'in one go' as a single stream of balefire. - 07/01/2010 01:46:16 AM 1004 Views
I agree with Templar - 09/01/2010 04:36:20 PM 901 Views
Re: I cannot follow your assumptions. - 06/01/2010 07:57:54 AM 1022 Views
Rand crossed a line - 06/01/2010 02:36:42 PM 1037 Views
Re: Rand crossed a line - 06/01/2010 04:16:12 PM 987 Views
But... - 06/01/2010 04:34:02 PM 1082 Views
Re: But... - 06/01/2010 06:14:25 PM 875 Views
Doesn't Balefire remove your thread from the Pattern permanently? - 06/01/2010 02:55:38 PM 1018 Views
No, RJ stated balefired people can be reborn. *NM* - 06/01/2010 03:26:00 PM 498 Views
But not in this turning of the Wheel. So they'd miss out on MANY lifetimes. - 06/01/2010 05:46:04 PM 945 Views
What? - 06/01/2010 06:20:56 PM 954 Views
Where did you get that? - 06/01/2010 07:09:38 PM 907 Views
No, balefire just kills you backwards in time. It is not super-death. *NM* - 06/01/2010 09:58:18 PM 511 Views
LOL ... super-death! - 06/01/2010 11:59:31 PM 887 Views
Hah! *NM* - 07/01/2010 12:06:07 AM 508 Views
It makes me think of History of the World Part 1 - 07/01/2010 12:53:20 AM 904 Views
It makes me think of History of the World Part 1 - 07/01/2010 12:53:33 AM 864 Views
Yes it was. - 06/01/2010 06:51:15 PM 1017 Views
Re: Yes it was. - 06/01/2010 07:16:14 PM 964 Views
Re: Yes it was. - 06/01/2010 08:58:40 PM 960 Views
Re: Yes it was. - 06/01/2010 10:47:11 PM 968 Views
let me ask the question in a different way - 06/01/2010 11:26:43 PM 968 Views
Re: let me ask the question in a different way - 06/01/2010 11:40:56 PM 946 Views
actually that quote supports my thoughts - 06/01/2010 11:50:40 PM 1017 Views
Re: actually that quote supports my thoughts - 07/01/2010 12:10:07 AM 899 Views
Meh. I just think advocating mass-murder is the opposite direction RJ meant for this to take. - 07/01/2010 12:00:44 AM 1016 Views
Sigh. What mass murder? - 07/01/2010 12:15:01 AM 849 Views
you are kidding right? - 07/01/2010 12:19:58 AM 958 Views
In this book Rand was a wimp and a bully. - 07/01/2010 03:14:32 PM 925 Views
Re: In this book Rand was a wimp and a bully. - 07/01/2010 03:57:43 PM 947 Views
Re: In this book Rand was a wimp and a bully. - 07/01/2010 07:13:21 PM 953 Views
Re: In this book Rand was a wimp and a bully. - 07/01/2010 07:52:24 PM 883 Views
Re: In this book Rand was a wimp and a bully. - 07/01/2010 08:56:43 PM 973 Views
Re: In this book Rand was a wimp and a bully. - 07/01/2010 09:26:01 PM 918 Views
Re: In this book Rand was a wimp and a bully. - 07/01/2010 09:30:45 PM 853 Views
Personally I'm kind of sick of Rand being the only person killing FS! - 07/01/2010 09:42:57 PM 1017 Views
Re: In this book Rand was a wimp and a bully. - 07/01/2010 09:56:02 PM 970 Views
OK I'm sorry but this gets a huge ROFL :lol: - 07/01/2010 10:30:19 PM 973 Views
Re: OK I'm sorry but this gets a huge ROFL :lol: - 08/01/2010 01:53:25 PM 912 Views
Re: OK I'm sorry but this gets a huge ROFL :lol: - 08/01/2010 02:56:41 PM 948 Views
What might work... - 08/01/2010 12:35:17 PM 860 Views
Re: What might work... - 08/01/2010 11:38:09 PM 874 Views
Yes. Anakin Skywalker all over again - 06/01/2010 11:01:02 PM 1043 Views
Meh - 06/01/2010 11:30:24 PM 884 Views
The worst part about his atrocities is his rationalizing them! - 06/01/2010 11:33:32 PM 880 Views
Re: The worst part about his atrocities is his rationalizing them! - 06/01/2010 11:50:37 PM 968 Views
Re: The worst part about his atrocities is his rationalizing them! - 06/01/2010 11:55:03 PM 944 Views
I do have to guiltily say, though, that if Rand had balefired the Seanchan and THEN became good... - 07/01/2010 12:03:20 AM 937 Views
*laughs behind hand* - 07/01/2010 12:05:54 AM 1000 Views
Re: The worst part about his atrocities is his rationalizing them! - 07/01/2010 12:23:11 AM 868 Views
I don't think Rand or LTT (who has/have) little capacity for Healing - 07/01/2010 12:52:25 AM 900 Views
Re: I don't think Rand or LTT (who has/have) little capacity for Healing - 07/01/2010 01:24:32 AM 951 Views
Re: I don't think Rand or LTT (who has/have) little capacity for Healing - 07/01/2010 03:33:52 PM 884 Views
Re: I don't think Rand or LTT (who has/have) little capacity for Healing - 07/01/2010 04:28:18 PM 1034 Views
right cause all Generals are so well versed in medical conditions - 07/01/2010 09:44:09 PM 1006 Views
Nice way to avoid the argument. - 07/01/2010 10:00:17 PM 943 Views
I'm just done talking in circles. You seem to think that because people - 07/01/2010 11:53:05 PM 969 Views
I concede - 07/01/2010 01:09:11 AM 871 Views
You weren't wrong overall, but there were some serious flaws in your reasoning. - 07/01/2010 02:43:17 AM 1004 Views
Tee hee. - 07/01/2010 05:28:52 AM 943 Views
Morals are subjective anyhow, - 07/01/2010 06:23:09 AM 955 Views
Re: Morals are subjective anyhow, - 07/01/2010 03:23:59 PM 892 Views
I have religious beliefs and that is an absurd contention - 09/01/2010 12:00:02 AM 957 Views
Re: I have religious beliefs and that is an absurd contention - 09/01/2010 05:56:16 PM 1135 Views
Re: I have religious beliefs and that is an absurd contention - 18/01/2010 01:00:23 PM 1264 Views
Your assertions weaken your overall argument. - 11/01/2010 04:47:10 PM 850 Views
Re: Your assertions weaken your overall argument. - 18/01/2010 12:49:26 PM 892 Views

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