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You are basing this entire post on a fundamentally flawed premise darius_sedai Send a noteboard - 12/10/2012 04:13:06 AM
ALL effects are created by WEAVES. Fireballs are weaves, we've even heard from the characters that the motion you learn is part of the weave.

Why are we even debating that Traveling is a Talent. Not only do we have an abundance of quotes stating it, but it was called out as such in the glossary and in the BWB ... AND we've now seen a number of characters who can manipulate the weave to far greater degrees than their strength alone should dictate! Show me where Traveling is disproven as a Talent.
Domani Drag Queen in the White Tower ... Aran'gar watch out!
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Problems with gateways Narg - 28/09/2012 05:02:47 PM 3159 Views
Uh, yeah, well, whenever you notice something like that... a wizard did it. *NM* Tom - 28/09/2012 05:47:13 PM 793 Views
Yeah, I realize that raising physics questions about fantasy books can be absurd... Narg - 28/09/2012 06:03:05 PM 1357 Views
It's been discussed before... DomA - 28/09/2012 06:04:35 PM 1706 Views
I would agree with this A Deathwatch Guard - 28/09/2012 06:35:14 PM 1411 Views
Re: I would agree with this DomA - 28/09/2012 06:56:57 PM 1505 Views
Egwene would likely also know since she puzzled it out as well darius_sedai - 28/09/2012 07:28:22 PM 1486 Views
Especially when opening a gateway into a void like in Skimming (though that is probably T'A'R too) Onarishma - 04/10/2012 03:13:29 PM 1385 Views
Regarding shadowspawn: Narg - 28/09/2012 07:19:38 PM 1746 Views
Isn't there a quote somewhere about this? darius_sedai - 28/09/2012 07:30:40 PM 1471 Views
There is echooff - 28/09/2012 07:52:30 PM 1379 Views
Can Fain pass through a Gateway? Marshall - 28/09/2012 08:11:59 PM 1413 Views
Re: Can Fain pass through a Gateway? DomA - 02/10/2012 02:37:58 AM 1400 Views
Here's a neat idea Marshall - 28/09/2012 08:07:52 PM 1559 Views
Found an interesting quote when I was looking into something else darius_sedai - 07/10/2012 12:57:21 AM 1208 Views
I don't think RJ thought about it Sidious - 28/09/2012 07:44:34 PM 1432 Views
Absurd question... fionwe1987 - 28/09/2012 10:44:53 PM 1437 Views
Doesn't it meet your standards? Sidious - 29/09/2012 07:47:12 AM 1518 Views
Gateways, Tel'aran'rhiod and Dreamspikes... fionwe1987 - 28/09/2012 11:02:39 PM 1614 Views
Re: Gateways, Tel'aran'rhiod and Dreamspikes... LoialT - 28/09/2012 11:12:54 PM 1444 Views
Wow, that makes a lot of sense. *NM* Dreadlord - 01/10/2012 07:30:22 PM 737 Views
Re: Gateways, Tel'aran'rhiod and Dreamspikes... DomA - 01/10/2012 09:03:47 PM 1653 Views
Androl throws a kink in this darius_sedai - 02/10/2012 01:14:16 AM 1423 Views
Re: Androl throws a kink in this DomA - 02/10/2012 02:30:23 AM 1591 Views
He said he can make one large enough for a Wagon to pass through darius_sedai - 02/10/2012 03:23:26 AM 1306 Views
Gateway Talent I'd say Sidious - 02/10/2012 08:55:26 AM 1403 Views
I think Androl is proof that gateways are more about a the Talent than strength darius_sedai - 02/10/2012 09:00:26 AM 1468 Views
No I think they're more about strength Sidious - 02/10/2012 09:27:17 AM 1563 Views
I disagree with Logain being a credible source on this darius_sedai - 02/10/2012 04:47:59 PM 1478 Views
Re: I disagree with Logain being a credible source on this Sidious - 03/10/2012 07:04:11 AM 1434 Views
Re: I disagree with Logain being a credible source on this fionwe1987 - 03/10/2012 07:43:12 AM 1437 Views
Re: I disagree with Logain being a credible source on this Sidious - 03/10/2012 09:59:13 AM 1408 Views
Egwene could not heal Gawyn darius_sedai - 03/10/2012 02:34:08 PM 1515 Views
She did Heal him Sidious - 04/10/2012 08:30:14 AM 1356 Views
and *gasp* maybe breeding. Onarishma - 04/10/2012 05:36:59 PM 1375 Views
Re-read some stuff darius_sedai - 04/10/2012 07:57:50 PM 1442 Views
Re: Re-read some stuff Sidious - 05/10/2012 08:22:06 AM 1313 Views
Um she tries out of desperation? darius_sedai - 05/10/2012 03:06:59 PM 1430 Views
Logain may be correct that Rand is stronger, but his reason is not correct darius_sedai - 03/10/2012 02:13:08 PM 1634 Views
But his thought processes are sound Sidious - 04/10/2012 08:20:13 AM 1350 Views
It's in Chapter 5 of TGS darius_sedai - 04/10/2012 09:48:49 PM 1412 Views
Re: It's in Chapter 5 of TGS Sidious - 05/10/2012 08:28:13 AM 1358 Views
Why was Flinn so late and why bring up his Gateway? darius_sedai - 05/10/2012 04:15:47 PM 1348 Views
Ummm... fionwe1987 - 05/10/2012 08:42:19 PM 1310 Views
Re: Ummm... Sidious - 06/10/2012 07:53:10 AM 1448 Views
I don't think RJ changed his mind darius_sedai - 06/10/2012 03:13:44 PM 1268 Views
Re: I don't think RJ changed his mind DomA - 07/10/2012 07:28:38 PM 1530 Views
I wasn't being very clear darius_sedai - 07/10/2012 09:45:15 PM 1431 Views
I think he did Sidious - 08/10/2012 05:32:35 PM 1404 Views
Maybe darius_sedai - 08/10/2012 07:48:24 PM 1303 Views
still don't think that's proof. It's just practical. Onarishma - 11/10/2012 07:06:15 PM 1346 Views
Interesting point you bring up about fighting for control darius_sedai - 12/10/2012 03:44:26 AM 1308 Views
She wouldn't have to guess! Onarishma - 09/10/2012 08:43:54 PM 1320 Views
Really? Where is that quote? All we've heard is a woman needs to be strong enough darius_sedai - 09/10/2012 11:44:15 PM 1300 Views
There is only one book left. It is definitely not LIKELY Onarishma - 11/10/2012 08:06:04 PM 1322 Views
I can agree with most of that ... I simply believe that the Talent dictates the amount of strength darius_sedai - 12/10/2012 03:53:21 AM 1244 Views
Exactly... fionwe1987 - 10/10/2012 12:35:16 AM 1207 Views
Re: Exactly... Sidious - 10/10/2012 10:29:13 AM 1259 Views
Re: Exactly... fionwe1987 - 10/10/2012 10:06:08 PM 1342 Views
AND... darius_sedai - 10/10/2012 10:15:14 PM 1208 Views
Re: AND... Sidious - 11/10/2012 04:46:31 PM 1405 Views
Again THANK YOU! Onarishma - 11/10/2012 08:35:10 PM 1190 Views
Re: AND... darius_sedai - 12/10/2012 04:09:25 AM 1313 Views
Re: AND... Sidious - 12/10/2012 08:57:46 AM 1359 Views
I only discount direct statements when we are explicitly shown that they are incorrect darius_sedai - 13/10/2012 06:55:38 PM 1340 Views
Because let's be honest, it's rarely a Talent and you both know it Sidious - 11/10/2012 04:44:27 PM 1433 Views
TY!!! Onarishma - 11/10/2012 08:38:44 PM 1441 Views
You are basing this entire post on a fundamentally flawed premise darius_sedai - 12/10/2012 04:13:06 AM 1550 Views
Re: You are basing this entire post on a fundamentally flawed premise Sidious - 12/10/2012 08:52:02 AM 1336 Views
Are you reading mine? darius_sedai - 13/10/2012 07:09:02 PM 1272 Views
Apoplexy, that is what is happening on my side of the screen Onarishma - 11/10/2012 08:31:30 PM 1145 Views
the fact that Egwene is proven incorrect on this any number of times? darius_sedai - 12/10/2012 04:14:35 AM 1386 Views
THANK YOU!!! Onarishma - 11/10/2012 08:26:49 PM 1299 Views
Re: Logain may be correct that Rand is stronger, but his reason is not correct Onarishma - 04/10/2012 09:51:08 PM 1348 Views
to the point on the Circle darius_sedai - 06/10/2012 09:36:18 PM 1383 Views
Circles don't add the Talents... fionwe1987 - 07/10/2012 03:34:47 AM 1326 Views
I had forgotten about Brendas! darius_sedai - 07/10/2012 05:15:52 AM 1338 Views
I've been thinking about this darius_sedai - 07/10/2012 10:11:22 PM 1270 Views
Circles give added precision, remember? fionwe1987 - 07/10/2012 11:27:05 PM 1309 Views
I get that, but the evidence in front of me from the text is inconsistent to the quote darius_sedai - 08/10/2012 12:11:15 AM 1168 Views
Circles of larger numbers give added benefit... fionwe1987 - 08/10/2012 02:00:58 AM 1365 Views
Egwene with a sa'angreal might be like 15x her natural strength, so maybe 9-10x Rand darius_sedai - 08/10/2012 02:59:26 AM 1275 Views
Highly doubtful... fionwe1987 - 08/10/2012 01:36:47 PM 1299 Views
Meh, I don't really care all that much, I just don't think this adds up to the text. darius_sedai - 08/10/2012 03:31:20 PM 1274 Views
Re: Meh, I don't really care all that much, I just don't think this adds up to the text. Sidious - 08/10/2012 05:57:04 PM 1318 Views
That is actually the crux of my issue darius_sedai - 08/10/2012 07:52:52 PM 1279 Views
That's why its called exponential. It is NOT linear and that why the gains look ridiculous Onarishma - 11/10/2012 10:00:15 PM 1328 Views
Yet that only explains when a circle does certain things darius_sedai - 12/10/2012 04:18:36 AM 1333 Views
the text is not inconsistent. Onarishma - 19/10/2012 08:20:52 PM 1791 Views
I see, it only counts when it supports your point! Why didn't I think of that! darius_sedai - 20/10/2012 03:58:27 AM 1428 Views
RJ specifically said that was ONLY because of Forsaken skill level Onarishma - 11/10/2012 09:02:03 PM 1332 Views
Not so much darius_sedai - 12/10/2012 04:28:44 AM 1336 Views
I'm still arguing about this but I think the evidence is that AS holding a shield are not linked. Onarishma - 11/10/2012 08:59:20 PM 1374 Views
I've given this point some thought too ... It's a dicey subject darius_sedai - 12/10/2012 04:22:23 AM 1210 Views
THAT is proof of the power of LINKING. This is why thirteen Morgases could smash Rand. Onarishma - 11/10/2012 08:41:45 PM 1219 Views
It's one example that supports the exponential increase ... not arguing that darius_sedai - 12/10/2012 04:40:08 AM 1303 Views
Re: to the point on the Circle Onarishma - 07/10/2012 06:09:48 PM 1309 Views
Healing is a thing of the physical body darius_sedai - 07/10/2012 09:50:37 PM 1327 Views
Suian was stilled for hiding these boys. obviously trust was the issue. not healing skill. *NM* Onarishma - 11/10/2012 10:11:50 PM 587 Views
Didn't I just say that? darius_sedai - 12/10/2012 04:31:22 AM 1251 Views
That's what makes a Talent a Talent.... Onarishma - 04/10/2012 05:02:36 PM 1336 Views
There is so much evidence against this darius_sedai - 04/10/2012 08:04:45 PM 1399 Views
Androl does not match Rands Gateway size. Onarishma - 05/10/2012 05:59:34 PM 1429 Views
Rand states straight out that gateway size is not OP strength dependent. fionwe1987 - 05/10/2012 08:51:58 PM 1262 Views
+500 ... Well said sir! *NM* darius_sedai - 06/10/2012 04:52:38 AM 896 Views
He's referring to skimming Sidious - 06/10/2012 07:08:14 AM 1440 Views
I think we aren't far off in interpretation darius_sedai - 06/10/2012 02:48:46 PM 1319 Views
Re: I think we aren't far off in interpretation Sidious - 08/10/2012 05:41:12 PM 1313 Views
We are close enough on this point darius_sedai - 08/10/2012 08:02:48 PM 1446 Views
Re: Rand states straight out that gateway size is not OP strength dependent. Onarishma - 07/10/2012 06:37:32 PM 1343 Views
Please explain Androl then darius_sedai - 07/10/2012 09:48:54 PM 1349 Views
OMG. Androl DOES have a Talent. NO ONE is disputing that. Onarishma - 11/10/2012 10:50:41 PM 1320 Views
You have waffled back and forth on Traveling being a Talent darius_sedai - 14/10/2012 03:01:03 AM 1367 Views
there is no waffle here. plenty of syrup though.... Onarishma - 18/10/2012 06:53:34 PM 1392 Views
No it's not darius_sedai - 19/10/2012 04:25:25 AM 1189 Views
fionwe1987 - 07/10/2012 11:35:00 PM 1158 Views
i will gladly find you the quote where it it is the right size and ONLY takes more power. Onarishma - 11/10/2012 11:18:15 PM 1361 Views
I don't think so... Spirit is used in many weaves (like Healing) as part of the weave darius_sedai - 12/10/2012 04:38:29 AM 1306 Views
I was incorrect about the size. but ultimately not incorrect about her evaluation quote within Onarishma - 18/10/2012 03:28:30 PM 1496 Views
How many different times does the text have to say Traveling is a Talent? darius_sedai - 05/10/2012 11:54:19 PM 1264 Views
How do you know there's a difference? Sidious - 06/10/2012 06:53:33 AM 1370 Views
darius_sedai - 06/10/2012 03:15:25 PM 1306 Views
the text calls a lot of things Talents when they're just lost weaves...Traveling is one of them. *NM* Onarishma - 07/10/2012 07:03:35 PM 829 Views
Not really darius_sedai - 07/10/2012 09:57:56 PM 1306 Views
I agree with this PoV Sidious - 06/10/2012 07:19:52 AM 1478 Views
Yes, Healing Talent is incredibly rare and only implies out of proportion ability... darius_sedai - 06/10/2012 03:36:24 PM 1296 Views
I think you use the word Talent too liberally Sidious - 08/10/2012 05:45:39 PM 1413 Views
I disagree darius_sedai - 08/10/2012 08:08:04 PM 1286 Views
I sort of agree with Sidious there DomA - 09/10/2012 03:03:54 PM 1293 Views
Flinn has difficulty with the weave. Unlike Aviendha he doesn't has a second weave problem darius_sedai - 09/10/2012 06:17:34 PM 1260 Views
Re: Yes, Healing Talent is incredibly rare and only implies out of proportion ability... Onarishma - 09/10/2012 02:37:10 PM 1475 Views
That has no relevance here darius_sedai - 09/10/2012 06:29:34 PM 1237 Views
Beonin's Gateway v. Egwene's v. Rand's v. Aviendha and Elayne Edit: made a math mistake darius_sedai - 06/10/2012 08:34:56 PM 1772 Views
This debate is restricted by the "largest Gateway possible" issue. And some added points to consider fionwe1987 - 07/10/2012 03:49:05 AM 1296 Views
This debate is restricted by the "largest Gateway possible" issue. And some added points to consider fionwe1987 - 07/10/2012 04:09:33 AM 1267 Views
Re: This debate is restricted by the "largest Gateway possible" issue. DomA - 07/10/2012 07:46:51 PM 1426 Views
Cadsuane possessing a strong Talent for Traveling would not be surprising to me darius_sedai - 07/10/2012 10:15:17 PM 1361 Views
I noticed that... fionwe1987 - 07/10/2012 11:38:18 PM 1408 Views
Re: This debate is restricted by the "largest Gateway possible" issue. Sidious - 08/10/2012 05:47:57 PM 1267 Views
Re: This debate is restricted by the "largest Gateway possible" issue. DomA - 09/10/2012 05:08:34 PM 1561 Views
On Healing and Yellows... fionwe1987 - 09/10/2012 05:24:11 PM 1316 Views
Re: On Healing and Yellows... DomA - 09/10/2012 06:07:20 PM 1473 Views
True darius_sedai - 07/10/2012 10:01:42 PM 1351 Views
Life skills and OP skills... fionwe1987 - 02/10/2012 06:40:00 AM 1218 Views
Or the reverse could be true darius_sedai - 02/10/2012 08:43:37 AM 1385 Views
Re: Or the reverse could be true Sidious - 02/10/2012 09:12:28 AM 1422 Views
And Egwene was training to be Wisdom ... I don't know that any of this is true 100% of the time darius_sedai - 02/10/2012 04:55:30 PM 1347 Views
Re: And Egwene was training to be Wisdom ... I don't know that any of this is true 100% of the time DomA - 03/10/2012 12:55:01 AM 1480 Views
The point is the same regardless darius_sedai - 03/10/2012 05:14:36 AM 1377 Views
Here's an answer to your original question Sidious - 06/10/2012 07:21:27 AM 1443 Views
*takes a bow* ... thanks for finding that quote! *NM* darius_sedai - 06/10/2012 08:41:49 PM 697 Views
Re: Or the reverse could be true DomA - 02/10/2012 01:02:03 PM 1469 Views
You misunderstand the nature of the Yellow darius_sedai - 02/10/2012 05:06:20 PM 1383 Views
I know DomA - 02/10/2012 07:27:14 PM 1427 Views
Our stance seems to be Nature v. nurture in nature darius_sedai - 02/10/2012 11:21:50 PM 1387 Views
weaves are not magical entities that exist in channelers. They are tools that are invented. Onarishma - 05/10/2012 06:17:31 PM 1346 Views
Re: Gateways, Tel'aran'rhiod and Dreamspikes... fionwe1987 - 02/10/2012 06:38:11 AM 1386 Views
Trollocs have dreams Onarishma - 05/10/2012 06:39:49 PM 1469 Views
Re: Gateways, Tel'aran'rhiod and Dreamspikes... DomA - 06/10/2012 02:05:30 PM 1393 Views
Was Avendoraldera a separate construct, and what to make of the Green Man cosmology? LoialT - 06/10/2012 06:54:27 PM 1425 Views
Re: Was Avendoraldera a separate construct, and what to make of the Green Man cosmology? DomA - 06/10/2012 10:04:41 PM 1586 Views
XKCD is on the case! Tor - 03/10/2012 06:05:54 AM 1339 Views
Re: Problems with gateways Onarishma - 04/10/2012 03:10:48 PM 1201 Views
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