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You are basing this entire post on a fundamentally flawed premise darius_sedai Send a noteboard - 12/10/2012 04:13:06 AM
ALL effects are created by WEAVES. Fireballs are weaves, we've even heard from the characters that the motion you learn is part of the weave.

Why are we even debating that Traveling is a Talent. Not only do we have an abundance of quotes stating it, but it was called out as such in the glossary and in the BWB ... AND we've now seen a number of characters who can manipulate the weave to far greater degrees than their strength alone should dictate! Show me where Traveling is disproven as a Talent.
Domani Drag Queen in the White Tower ... Aran'gar watch out!
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Problems with gateways Narg - 28/09/2012 05:02:47 PM 3030 Views
Uh, yeah, well, whenever you notice something like that... a wizard did it. *NM* Tom - 28/09/2012 05:47:13 PM 720 Views
Yeah, I realize that raising physics questions about fantasy books can be absurd... Narg - 28/09/2012 06:03:05 PM 1228 Views
It's been discussed before... DomA - 28/09/2012 06:04:35 PM 1589 Views
I would agree with this A Deathwatch Guard - 28/09/2012 06:35:14 PM 1239 Views
Re: I would agree with this DomA - 28/09/2012 06:56:57 PM 1370 Views
Egwene would likely also know since she puzzled it out as well darius_sedai - 28/09/2012 07:28:22 PM 1359 Views
Especially when opening a gateway into a void like in Skimming (though that is probably T'A'R too) Onarishma - 04/10/2012 03:13:29 PM 1250 Views
Regarding shadowspawn: Narg - 28/09/2012 07:19:38 PM 1571 Views
Isn't there a quote somewhere about this? darius_sedai - 28/09/2012 07:30:40 PM 1358 Views
There is echooff - 28/09/2012 07:52:30 PM 1250 Views
Can Fain pass through a Gateway? Marshall - 28/09/2012 08:11:59 PM 1280 Views
Re: Can Fain pass through a Gateway? DomA - 02/10/2012 02:37:58 AM 1272 Views
Here's a neat idea Marshall - 28/09/2012 08:07:52 PM 1401 Views
Found an interesting quote when I was looking into something else darius_sedai - 07/10/2012 12:57:21 AM 1070 Views
I don't think RJ thought about it Sidious - 28/09/2012 07:44:34 PM 1271 Views
Absurd question... fionwe1987 - 28/09/2012 10:44:53 PM 1312 Views
Doesn't it meet your standards? Sidious - 29/09/2012 07:47:12 AM 1384 Views
Gateways, Tel'aran'rhiod and Dreamspikes... fionwe1987 - 28/09/2012 11:02:39 PM 1470 Views
Re: Gateways, Tel'aran'rhiod and Dreamspikes... LoialT - 28/09/2012 11:12:54 PM 1296 Views
Wow, that makes a lot of sense. *NM* Dreadlord - 01/10/2012 07:30:22 PM 647 Views
Re: Gateways, Tel'aran'rhiod and Dreamspikes... DomA - 01/10/2012 09:03:47 PM 1512 Views
Androl throws a kink in this darius_sedai - 02/10/2012 01:14:16 AM 1284 Views
Re: Androl throws a kink in this DomA - 02/10/2012 02:30:23 AM 1437 Views
He said he can make one large enough for a Wagon to pass through darius_sedai - 02/10/2012 03:23:26 AM 1178 Views
Gateway Talent I'd say Sidious - 02/10/2012 08:55:26 AM 1278 Views
I think Androl is proof that gateways are more about a the Talent than strength darius_sedai - 02/10/2012 09:00:26 AM 1311 Views
No I think they're more about strength Sidious - 02/10/2012 09:27:17 AM 1426 Views
I disagree with Logain being a credible source on this darius_sedai - 02/10/2012 04:47:59 PM 1302 Views
Re: I disagree with Logain being a credible source on this Sidious - 03/10/2012 07:04:11 AM 1288 Views
Re: I disagree with Logain being a credible source on this fionwe1987 - 03/10/2012 07:43:12 AM 1303 Views
Re: I disagree with Logain being a credible source on this Sidious - 03/10/2012 09:59:13 AM 1251 Views
Egwene could not heal Gawyn darius_sedai - 03/10/2012 02:34:08 PM 1346 Views
She did Heal him Sidious - 04/10/2012 08:30:14 AM 1213 Views
and *gasp* maybe breeding. Onarishma - 04/10/2012 05:36:59 PM 1222 Views
Re-read some stuff darius_sedai - 04/10/2012 07:57:50 PM 1304 Views
Re: Re-read some stuff Sidious - 05/10/2012 08:22:06 AM 1180 Views
Um she tries out of desperation? darius_sedai - 05/10/2012 03:06:59 PM 1276 Views
Logain may be correct that Rand is stronger, but his reason is not correct darius_sedai - 03/10/2012 02:13:08 PM 1498 Views
But his thought processes are sound Sidious - 04/10/2012 08:20:13 AM 1199 Views
It's in Chapter 5 of TGS darius_sedai - 04/10/2012 09:48:49 PM 1273 Views
Re: It's in Chapter 5 of TGS Sidious - 05/10/2012 08:28:13 AM 1195 Views
Why was Flinn so late and why bring up his Gateway? darius_sedai - 05/10/2012 04:15:47 PM 1225 Views
Ummm... fionwe1987 - 05/10/2012 08:42:19 PM 1179 Views
Re: Ummm... Sidious - 06/10/2012 07:53:10 AM 1307 Views
I don't think RJ changed his mind darius_sedai - 06/10/2012 03:13:44 PM 1142 Views
Re: I don't think RJ changed his mind DomA - 07/10/2012 07:28:38 PM 1356 Views
I wasn't being very clear darius_sedai - 07/10/2012 09:45:15 PM 1278 Views
I think he did Sidious - 08/10/2012 05:32:35 PM 1277 Views
Maybe darius_sedai - 08/10/2012 07:48:24 PM 1184 Views
still don't think that's proof. It's just practical. Onarishma - 11/10/2012 07:06:15 PM 1199 Views
Interesting point you bring up about fighting for control darius_sedai - 12/10/2012 03:44:26 AM 1162 Views
She wouldn't have to guess! Onarishma - 09/10/2012 08:43:54 PM 1184 Views
Really? Where is that quote? All we've heard is a woman needs to be strong enough darius_sedai - 09/10/2012 11:44:15 PM 1167 Views
There is only one book left. It is definitely not LIKELY Onarishma - 11/10/2012 08:06:04 PM 1190 Views
I can agree with most of that ... I simply believe that the Talent dictates the amount of strength darius_sedai - 12/10/2012 03:53:21 AM 1117 Views
Exactly... fionwe1987 - 10/10/2012 12:35:16 AM 1075 Views
Re: Exactly... Sidious - 10/10/2012 10:29:13 AM 1107 Views
Re: Exactly... fionwe1987 - 10/10/2012 10:06:08 PM 1212 Views
AND... darius_sedai - 10/10/2012 10:15:14 PM 1083 Views
Re: AND... Sidious - 11/10/2012 04:46:31 PM 1256 Views
Again THANK YOU! Onarishma - 11/10/2012 08:35:10 PM 1053 Views
Re: AND... darius_sedai - 12/10/2012 04:09:25 AM 1186 Views
Re: AND... Sidious - 12/10/2012 08:57:46 AM 1238 Views
I only discount direct statements when we are explicitly shown that they are incorrect darius_sedai - 13/10/2012 06:55:38 PM 1173 Views
Because let's be honest, it's rarely a Talent and you both know it Sidious - 11/10/2012 04:44:27 PM 1264 Views
TY!!! Onarishma - 11/10/2012 08:38:44 PM 1265 Views
You are basing this entire post on a fundamentally flawed premise darius_sedai - 12/10/2012 04:13:06 AM 1432 Views
Re: You are basing this entire post on a fundamentally flawed premise Sidious - 12/10/2012 08:52:02 AM 1206 Views
Are you reading mine? darius_sedai - 13/10/2012 07:09:02 PM 1133 Views
Apoplexy, that is what is happening on my side of the screen Onarishma - 11/10/2012 08:31:30 PM 1003 Views
the fact that Egwene is proven incorrect on this any number of times? darius_sedai - 12/10/2012 04:14:35 AM 1238 Views
THANK YOU!!! Onarishma - 11/10/2012 08:26:49 PM 1168 Views
Re: Logain may be correct that Rand is stronger, but his reason is not correct Onarishma - 04/10/2012 09:51:08 PM 1217 Views
to the point on the Circle darius_sedai - 06/10/2012 09:36:18 PM 1240 Views
Circles don't add the Talents... fionwe1987 - 07/10/2012 03:34:47 AM 1188 Views
I had forgotten about Brendas! darius_sedai - 07/10/2012 05:15:52 AM 1189 Views
I've been thinking about this darius_sedai - 07/10/2012 10:11:22 PM 1138 Views
Circles give added precision, remember? fionwe1987 - 07/10/2012 11:27:05 PM 1165 Views
I get that, but the evidence in front of me from the text is inconsistent to the quote darius_sedai - 08/10/2012 12:11:15 AM 1043 Views
Circles of larger numbers give added benefit... fionwe1987 - 08/10/2012 02:00:58 AM 1223 Views
Egwene with a sa'angreal might be like 15x her natural strength, so maybe 9-10x Rand darius_sedai - 08/10/2012 02:59:26 AM 1137 Views
Highly doubtful... fionwe1987 - 08/10/2012 01:36:47 PM 1174 Views
Meh, I don't really care all that much, I just don't think this adds up to the text. darius_sedai - 08/10/2012 03:31:20 PM 1138 Views
Re: Meh, I don't really care all that much, I just don't think this adds up to the text. Sidious - 08/10/2012 05:57:04 PM 1176 Views
That is actually the crux of my issue darius_sedai - 08/10/2012 07:52:52 PM 1144 Views
That's why its called exponential. It is NOT linear and that why the gains look ridiculous Onarishma - 11/10/2012 10:00:15 PM 1193 Views
Yet that only explains when a circle does certain things darius_sedai - 12/10/2012 04:18:36 AM 1203 Views
the text is not inconsistent. Onarishma - 19/10/2012 08:20:52 PM 1650 Views
I see, it only counts when it supports your point! Why didn't I think of that! darius_sedai - 20/10/2012 03:58:27 AM 1292 Views
RJ specifically said that was ONLY because of Forsaken skill level Onarishma - 11/10/2012 09:02:03 PM 1196 Views
Not so much darius_sedai - 12/10/2012 04:28:44 AM 1188 Views
I'm still arguing about this but I think the evidence is that AS holding a shield are not linked. Onarishma - 11/10/2012 08:59:20 PM 1231 Views
I've given this point some thought too ... It's a dicey subject darius_sedai - 12/10/2012 04:22:23 AM 1088 Views
THAT is proof of the power of LINKING. This is why thirteen Morgases could smash Rand. Onarishma - 11/10/2012 08:41:45 PM 1058 Views
It's one example that supports the exponential increase ... not arguing that darius_sedai - 12/10/2012 04:40:08 AM 1158 Views
Re: to the point on the Circle Onarishma - 07/10/2012 06:09:48 PM 1158 Views
Healing is a thing of the physical body darius_sedai - 07/10/2012 09:50:37 PM 1187 Views
Suian was stilled for hiding these boys. obviously trust was the issue. not healing skill. *NM* Onarishma - 11/10/2012 10:11:50 PM 518 Views
Didn't I just say that? darius_sedai - 12/10/2012 04:31:22 AM 1115 Views
That's what makes a Talent a Talent.... Onarishma - 04/10/2012 05:02:36 PM 1206 Views
There is so much evidence against this darius_sedai - 04/10/2012 08:04:45 PM 1276 Views
Androl does not match Rands Gateway size. Onarishma - 05/10/2012 05:59:34 PM 1288 Views
Rand states straight out that gateway size is not OP strength dependent. fionwe1987 - 05/10/2012 08:51:58 PM 1128 Views
+500 ... Well said sir! *NM* darius_sedai - 06/10/2012 04:52:38 AM 829 Views
He's referring to skimming Sidious - 06/10/2012 07:08:14 AM 1313 Views
I think we aren't far off in interpretation darius_sedai - 06/10/2012 02:48:46 PM 1171 Views
Re: I think we aren't far off in interpretation Sidious - 08/10/2012 05:41:12 PM 1157 Views
We are close enough on this point darius_sedai - 08/10/2012 08:02:48 PM 1300 Views
Re: Rand states straight out that gateway size is not OP strength dependent. Onarishma - 07/10/2012 06:37:32 PM 1207 Views
Please explain Androl then darius_sedai - 07/10/2012 09:48:54 PM 1214 Views
OMG. Androl DOES have a Talent. NO ONE is disputing that. Onarishma - 11/10/2012 10:50:41 PM 1185 Views
You have waffled back and forth on Traveling being a Talent darius_sedai - 14/10/2012 03:01:03 AM 1217 Views
there is no waffle here. plenty of syrup though.... Onarishma - 18/10/2012 06:53:34 PM 1249 Views
No it's not darius_sedai - 19/10/2012 04:25:25 AM 1074 Views
fionwe1987 - 07/10/2012 11:35:00 PM 1023 Views
i will gladly find you the quote where it it is the right size and ONLY takes more power. Onarishma - 11/10/2012 11:18:15 PM 1215 Views
I don't think so... Spirit is used in many weaves (like Healing) as part of the weave darius_sedai - 12/10/2012 04:38:29 AM 1174 Views
I was incorrect about the size. but ultimately not incorrect about her evaluation quote within Onarishma - 18/10/2012 03:28:30 PM 1355 Views
How many different times does the text have to say Traveling is a Talent? darius_sedai - 05/10/2012 11:54:19 PM 1129 Views
How do you know there's a difference? Sidious - 06/10/2012 06:53:33 AM 1201 Views
darius_sedai - 06/10/2012 03:15:25 PM 1178 Views
the text calls a lot of things Talents when they're just lost weaves...Traveling is one of them. *NM* Onarishma - 07/10/2012 07:03:35 PM 743 Views
Not really darius_sedai - 07/10/2012 09:57:56 PM 1155 Views
I agree with this PoV Sidious - 06/10/2012 07:19:52 AM 1332 Views
Yes, Healing Talent is incredibly rare and only implies out of proportion ability... darius_sedai - 06/10/2012 03:36:24 PM 1145 Views
I think you use the word Talent too liberally Sidious - 08/10/2012 05:45:39 PM 1264 Views
I disagree darius_sedai - 08/10/2012 08:08:04 PM 1162 Views
I sort of agree with Sidious there DomA - 09/10/2012 03:03:54 PM 1166 Views
Flinn has difficulty with the weave. Unlike Aviendha he doesn't has a second weave problem darius_sedai - 09/10/2012 06:17:34 PM 1127 Views
Re: Yes, Healing Talent is incredibly rare and only implies out of proportion ability... Onarishma - 09/10/2012 02:37:10 PM 1337 Views
That has no relevance here darius_sedai - 09/10/2012 06:29:34 PM 1085 Views
Beonin's Gateway v. Egwene's v. Rand's v. Aviendha and Elayne Edit: made a math mistake darius_sedai - 06/10/2012 08:34:56 PM 1616 Views
This debate is restricted by the "largest Gateway possible" issue. And some added points to consider fionwe1987 - 07/10/2012 03:49:05 AM 1160 Views
This debate is restricted by the "largest Gateway possible" issue. And some added points to consider fionwe1987 - 07/10/2012 04:09:33 AM 1122 Views
Re: This debate is restricted by the "largest Gateway possible" issue. DomA - 07/10/2012 07:46:51 PM 1280 Views
Cadsuane possessing a strong Talent for Traveling would not be surprising to me darius_sedai - 07/10/2012 10:15:17 PM 1209 Views
I noticed that... fionwe1987 - 07/10/2012 11:38:18 PM 1282 Views
Re: This debate is restricted by the "largest Gateway possible" issue. Sidious - 08/10/2012 05:47:57 PM 1143 Views
Re: This debate is restricted by the "largest Gateway possible" issue. DomA - 09/10/2012 05:08:34 PM 1420 Views
On Healing and Yellows... fionwe1987 - 09/10/2012 05:24:11 PM 1191 Views
Re: On Healing and Yellows... DomA - 09/10/2012 06:07:20 PM 1324 Views
True darius_sedai - 07/10/2012 10:01:42 PM 1201 Views
Life skills and OP skills... fionwe1987 - 02/10/2012 06:40:00 AM 1099 Views
Or the reverse could be true darius_sedai - 02/10/2012 08:43:37 AM 1248 Views
Re: Or the reverse could be true Sidious - 02/10/2012 09:12:28 AM 1283 Views
And Egwene was training to be Wisdom ... I don't know that any of this is true 100% of the time darius_sedai - 02/10/2012 04:55:30 PM 1211 Views
Re: And Egwene was training to be Wisdom ... I don't know that any of this is true 100% of the time DomA - 03/10/2012 12:55:01 AM 1341 Views
The point is the same regardless darius_sedai - 03/10/2012 05:14:36 AM 1234 Views
Here's an answer to your original question Sidious - 06/10/2012 07:21:27 AM 1292 Views
*takes a bow* ... thanks for finding that quote! *NM* darius_sedai - 06/10/2012 08:41:49 PM 629 Views
Re: Or the reverse could be true DomA - 02/10/2012 01:02:03 PM 1339 Views
You misunderstand the nature of the Yellow darius_sedai - 02/10/2012 05:06:20 PM 1248 Views
I know DomA - 02/10/2012 07:27:14 PM 1280 Views
Our stance seems to be Nature v. nurture in nature darius_sedai - 02/10/2012 11:21:50 PM 1234 Views
weaves are not magical entities that exist in channelers. They are tools that are invented. Onarishma - 05/10/2012 06:17:31 PM 1219 Views
Re: Gateways, Tel'aran'rhiod and Dreamspikes... fionwe1987 - 02/10/2012 06:38:11 AM 1234 Views
Trollocs have dreams Onarishma - 05/10/2012 06:39:49 PM 1307 Views
Re: Gateways, Tel'aran'rhiod and Dreamspikes... DomA - 06/10/2012 02:05:30 PM 1266 Views
Was Avendoraldera a separate construct, and what to make of the Green Man cosmology? LoialT - 06/10/2012 06:54:27 PM 1280 Views
Re: Was Avendoraldera a separate construct, and what to make of the Green Man cosmology? DomA - 06/10/2012 10:04:41 PM 1430 Views
XKCD is on the case! Tor - 03/10/2012 06:05:54 AM 1175 Views
Re: Problems with gateways Onarishma - 04/10/2012 03:10:48 PM 1066 Views
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