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Ever read Umberto Eco's How To Travel with a Salmon? Larry Send a noteboard - 12/04/2010 11:07:19 PM
I think it's pretty normal that most resolutions come in the last part of a series, not in the middle. That doesn't mean, though, that this middle part is unimportant. The thing is simply that WoT had an exceptional scope. One can compare this e.g. with Song of Ice & Fire or The Malazan Book of the Fallen. However, it's in my view dishonest to compare WoT with other works, which were simply constructed in a shorter way, and then critizise in the middle of the series that WoT is too long or pointless, that nothing happens or is ever resolved. It's like comparing a TV series like Lost with a 2 hours fantasy movie.


In that book of essays, he has a humorous bit about how to tell if a work is pornographic. If every single step along the way is detailed in laborious fashion, it may be pornographic. The level of detail in the WoT series approaches that level of graphicness. I'm not certain that the scope is any more "exceptional" than a compact, complex work such as Wolfe's "Solar Cycle," which ended up being 12 books, none of which were over 400 pages (and most under 300). It seems, again based on imperfect recall, that WoT is a much simpler story at heart than works like Wolfe's, but that it's been expanded well into the hundreds per volume just to have the quests last longer than most writers would find necessary for their works to flow well together. When whole volumes are little more than middles in which there are few to no mini-resolutions occurring, then wouldn't it be fair to note that instead of "exceptional scope," this series may just have suffered a bit of logorrhea?
Illusions fall like the husk of a fruit, one after another, and the fruit is experience. - Narrator, Sylvie

Je suis méchant.
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Author Adam Roberts tackled the WoT. - 19/03/2010 09:30:25 PM 10388 Views
A question for Larry - 19/03/2010 09:40:37 PM 2241 Views
Roberto Bolaño - 19/03/2010 11:09:57 PM 2015 Views
I completely agree with his review. - 19/03/2010 11:11:17 PM 2185 Views
Ouch! Somebody pull that guy off RJ! *NM* - 20/03/2010 03:47:07 AM 1000 Views
Can't say that I really disagree. - 20/03/2010 05:19:26 AM 1537 Views
My problem with the reviews: - 20/03/2010 06:29:08 AM 2108 Views
Hear Hear !!! ....................... = ........................ *NM* - 20/03/2010 06:37:11 AM 965 Views
I agree - 20/03/2010 11:19:29 AM 1636 Views
You know what else I'm finding annoying? - 07/04/2010 07:29:37 AM 1561 Views
Fully Agree *NM* - 21/06/2010 12:41:05 AM 858 Views
well I agree and disagree - 20/03/2010 06:51:29 AM 1926 Views
Re: well I agree and disagree - 20/03/2010 02:12:43 PM 1444 Views
I'd say just The Eye of the World - 20/03/2010 05:26:19 PM 1458 Views
Indeed - 21/03/2010 12:34:19 AM 1454 Views
These reviews are pathetic - 20/03/2010 12:52:22 PM 1437 Views
I'm amused by some of the responses - 20/03/2010 07:20:03 PM 1816 Views
+1 *NM* - 20/03/2010 10:48:14 PM 956 Views
Are you suggesting that we are unqualified to disagree with him ? - 20/03/2010 11:21:44 PM 1610 Views
No, I said rather that it's ridiculous to make such disparaging comments about his takes - 20/03/2010 11:37:56 PM 1639 Views
I considered doing so - 21/03/2010 12:27:27 AM 1428 Views
I will reply to myself: What's the problem McFly , chicken ? - 21/03/2010 12:29:36 AM 1403 Views
My sister called me chicken once - 10/04/2010 01:18:31 AM 1418 Views
what's wrong runt... are you yellah? *NM* - 10/04/2010 10:40:16 AM 941 Views
NICE! *NM* - 10/04/2010 02:19:44 PM 807 Views
Re: I'm amused by some of the responses - 23/03/2010 04:50:42 PM 1523 Views
And I'm even more amused by this response - 24/03/2010 01:11:50 AM 1460 Views
Re: And I'm even more amused by this response - 24/03/2010 03:03:28 AM 1323 Views
Nah, TGS was the only serious review of the series I've done - 24/03/2010 04:31:28 AM 1381 Views
On a completely unrelated note... - 24/03/2010 06:15:25 AM 1258 Views
Ha! - 24/03/2010 06:34:48 AM 1384 Views
My congratulations then . *NM* - 24/03/2010 06:36:11 AM 1278 Views
You say it as if I had been condemned to hell! - 24/03/2010 07:13:45 AM 1190 Views
No. Well, maybe. - 24/03/2010 06:52:28 PM 1311 Views
! - 24/03/2010 06:54:34 PM 1345 Views
Re: Author Adam Roberts tackled the WoT. - 22/03/2010 02:47:23 PM 1428 Views
Re: Author Adam Roberts tackled the WoT. - 23/03/2010 01:53:16 PM 1431 Views
Wow, you guys have completely missed the point of the Wheel of Time series - 22/03/2010 05:28:07 PM 1471 Views
There's a point to it? - 22/03/2010 06:47:12 PM 1464 Views
I thought the point was to write about a bunch of stuff happening? - 09/04/2010 03:42:49 PM 1464 Views
Re: Author Adam Roberts tackled the WoT. - 23/03/2010 04:54:38 PM 1383 Views
pfft wth-ever - 26/03/2010 12:35:53 AM 1278 Views
Dude's been up for more awards for his writing than RJ ever was - 26/03/2010 12:28:19 PM 1523 Views
bla bla bla - 29/03/2010 06:17:07 AM 1362 Views
Usually, it's spelled "blah" - 29/03/2010 07:03:51 AM 1372 Views
Wow. That post was more entertaining than Mr. Roberts' review. Thank you *NM* - 29/03/2010 08:23:41 AM 1139 Views
You must have low standards for entertainment - 29/03/2010 08:54:03 AM 1355 Views
Re: You must have low standards for entertainment - 29/03/2010 09:13:44 AM 1448 Views
I know you were, thus the at the least of my comment - 29/03/2010 09:19:30 AM 1324 Views
Unimpressed - 29/03/2010 10:50:07 PM 1698 Views
Thank you - 30/03/2010 12:35:39 AM 1262 Views
*Standing ovation for DomA* - 30/03/2010 07:36:59 AM 1464 Views
Yes. Also, Roberts is a wanker. *NM* - 05/04/2010 09:28:57 PM 968 Views
Re: Dude's been up for more awards for his writing than RJ ever was - 29/03/2010 04:32:23 PM 1444 Views
Might want to re-read their Wikis again. - 29/03/2010 07:07:11 PM 1334 Views
Awards - 29/03/2010 07:42:03 PM 1319 Views
That link is out of date - 29/03/2010 07:54:56 PM 1296 Views
Re: That link is out of date - 29/03/2010 08:22:03 PM 1431 Views
This is a battle of win/lose? - 29/03/2010 08:47:54 PM 1347 Views
Re: This is a battle of win/lose? - 29/03/2010 09:03:07 PM 1390 Views
*considers employing the Chewbacca defense* - 29/03/2010 09:28:06 PM 1380 Views
Re: *considers employing the Chewbacca defense* - 29/03/2010 09:44:58 PM 1433 Views
The final point explains the "defense" - 30/03/2010 12:24:56 AM 1260 Views
Re: The final point explains the "defense" - 30/03/2010 01:33:04 PM 1266 Views
No, no, no - 30/03/2010 06:38:41 PM 1326 Views
Re: No, no, no - 30/03/2010 07:51:34 PM 1385 Views
Still continuing, huh? - 31/03/2010 02:10:13 AM 1372 Views
Re: Still continuing, huh? - 31/03/2010 03:56:57 PM 1289 Views
Those were polls - 31/03/2010 08:46:07 PM 1326 Views
Re: Those were polls - 05/04/2010 03:22:13 PM 1277 Views
Does it gives him right to insult me? - 13/04/2011 02:10:32 PM 1283 Views
I wouldn't know. Was he speaking directly to you? - 14/04/2011 11:28:16 PM 1424 Views
He's now reviewed the third book - 26/03/2010 12:27:16 PM 1508 Views
Well, this time I must disagree with him . - 29/03/2010 07:31:40 AM 1321 Views
I don't think he was claiming that RJ was alone in doing that - 29/03/2010 07:44:07 AM 1282 Views
Hah! - 29/03/2010 06:07:28 PM 1293 Views
Well... - 29/03/2010 06:52:10 PM 1272 Views
Differing perspectives, I guess. - 29/03/2010 07:58:13 PM 1366 Views
I suppose - 29/03/2010 08:50:43 PM 1285 Views
Re: I suppose - 30/03/2010 12:18:30 AM 1442 Views
True - 30/03/2010 12:23:28 AM 1291 Views
Hey, DomA, do you know why the Shienarans randomly speak in the Old Tongue? - 30/03/2010 12:52:01 AM 1208 Views
Re: Hey, DomA, do you know why the Shienarans randomly speak in the Old Tongue? - 30/03/2010 07:45:08 AM 1338 Views
But why only them? - 30/03/2010 08:07:00 AM 1350 Views
Re: But why only them? - 30/03/2010 03:56:54 PM 1303 Views
Re: But why only them? - 30/03/2010 08:29:37 PM 1397 Views
I really liked a lot of the minor characters in The Great Hunt. - 30/03/2010 12:49:03 AM 1354 Views
I barely thought twice about those, to be honest - 30/03/2010 06:39:55 PM 1344 Views
I can't wait what he's going to try to do with TFoH and beyond - 28/03/2010 08:18:59 PM 1391 Views
Glad you enjoyed it - 29/03/2010 09:33:43 PM 1219 Views
The Shadow Rising review - 02/04/2010 09:42:53 AM 1492 Views
I wonder if this borders on trolling - 02/04/2010 02:29:58 PM 10096 Views
You want complaining? You got it... - 02/04/2010 06:38:09 PM 1391 Views
That would be a mistake - 02/04/2010 09:16:25 PM 1554 Views
Re: That would be a mistake - 02/04/2010 10:28:56 PM 1297 Views
I agree, Roberts is more and more coming across to me as just bitter - 10/04/2010 01:24:52 AM 1410 Views
Little late to this one as well - 10/04/2010 11:12:04 AM 1454 Views
Perhaps you should have led with this bit - 10/04/2010 02:52:23 PM 1512 Views
Re: I wonder if this borders on trolling - 04/04/2010 09:16:22 AM 1370 Views
What review? I couldn't find one... - 02/04/2010 08:00:45 PM 1545 Views
Re: What review? I couldn't find one... - 02/04/2010 09:22:13 PM 1509 Views
See my comment below - 02/04/2010 09:32:54 PM 1499 Views
Re: See my comment below - 03/04/2010 09:31:22 AM 1934 Views
Sorry I'm late in responding, but I've been quite busy this week - 07/04/2010 09:45:48 PM 1736 Views
Yes, I can probably agree with what you say here. - 08/04/2010 12:29:16 AM 1229 Views
- 08/04/2010 12:32:53 AM 1325 Views
I agree completely. *NM* - 02/04/2010 09:53:44 PM 855 Views
Speaking of irritation - 02/04/2010 10:50:04 PM 1502 Views
Commentary, then? - 02/04/2010 09:27:18 PM 1323 Views
Here's the thing... - 02/04/2010 10:11:18 PM 1336 Views
Re: Here's the thing... - 02/04/2010 10:31:56 PM 1209 Views
Re: Here's the thing... - 03/04/2010 01:34:05 AM 1237 Views
I somehow overlooked this last week, it seems - 10/04/2010 11:01:17 AM 1523 Views
Indeed - 02/04/2010 10:34:00 PM 1191 Views
Re: Commentary, then? - 05/04/2010 03:44:07 PM 1301 Views
for a man that bitterly complains about an author who is padding his work - 08/04/2010 09:41:07 PM 1453 Views
1400 words is long-winded? - 09/04/2010 10:07:41 AM 1494 Views
since you can sum up those 1400 words in about 25 yes that's longwinded - 09/04/2010 01:36:16 PM 1357 Views
Except I didn't really sum it up, as I left out quite a bit - 10/04/2010 11:15:42 AM 1425 Views
You are very defensive over this - 10/04/2010 01:54:15 PM 1203 Views
Nah, more of a devil's advocate than anything else - 12/04/2010 03:57:12 AM 1292 Views
Re: Nah, more of a devil's advocate than anything else - 12/04/2010 05:30:53 PM 1206 Views
You sound like a Goodkind webmaster from a couple of years ago - 12/04/2010 06:58:42 PM 1291 Views
You don't come across as a devil's advocate - 30/03/2011 03:07:32 PM 1249 Views
Well Larry I have started reading Gradsil by Adam Roberts - 07/04/2010 08:59:28 PM 1408 Views
I demand a paragraph by paragraph review, with footnotes! - 07/04/2010 09:50:39 PM 1328 Views
Re: I demand a paragraph by paragraph review, with footnotes! - 08/04/2010 01:06:20 PM 1199 Views
Which Invisible Man? - 09/04/2010 09:58:44 AM 1402 Views
Re: Which Invisible Man? - 09/04/2010 01:26:42 PM 1297 Views
I have a very different take on that book - 10/04/2010 11:17:13 AM 1285 Views
Re: I demand a paragraph by paragraph review, with footnotes! - 09/04/2010 01:45:44 PM 1340 Views
Hrmm... - 10/04/2010 11:19:01 AM 1159 Views
Re: Well Larry I have started reading Gradsil by Adam Roberts - 12/04/2010 05:37:36 PM 1389 Views
He brings up some interesting points, if in an unnecessarily rude manner - 08/04/2010 12:42:25 PM 1340 Views
To be honest, I doubt most readers of the series obsess over it that much - 09/04/2010 10:05:49 AM 1357 Views
Re: To be honest, I doubt most readers of the series obsess over it that much - 09/04/2010 01:28:17 PM 1853 Views
Re: To be honest, I doubt most readers of the series obsess over it that much - 10/04/2010 11:40:22 AM 1272 Views
why are you so bothered by people being unimpressed with Roberts? - 10/04/2010 02:19:08 PM 1397 Views
I don't understand it either - 11/04/2010 12:44:25 PM 1358 Views
right? - 11/04/2010 02:13:00 PM 1368 Views
Nah - 12/04/2010 04:13:44 AM 1171 Views
And in vol. 5, Roberts discovers the horrors of the circus - 09/04/2010 09:57:03 AM 1311 Views
5 reviews without saying more than "I hate the series" - 09/04/2010 01:31:13 PM 1221 Views
Basically he just states the "nothing happens"-argument... - 09/04/2010 03:26:02 PM 1235 Views
Well, what was really resolved here? - 10/04/2010 11:25:25 AM 1225 Views
Well... - 12/04/2010 05:05:20 PM 1413 Views
well exactly - 12/04/2010 05:33:11 PM 1437 Views
So very little was resolved and much was set into motion, then? - 12/04/2010 06:55:45 PM 1397 Views
Yes... - 12/04/2010 10:51:08 PM 1176 Views
Ever read Umberto Eco's How To Travel with a Salmon? - 12/04/2010 11:07:19 PM 1403 Views
I guess... - 13/04/2010 10:03:03 AM 1433 Views
Sounds like you value prolixity for the sake of prolixity, to be honest - 13/04/2010 04:41:07 PM 2582 Views
Nah... - 13/04/2010 05:29:34 PM 1185 Views
He's read and enjoyed Proust, among others - 13/04/2010 07:37:39 PM 1240 Views
Ah, well... - 13/04/2010 09:45:45 PM 1210 Views
Dismissive, much? - 13/04/2010 10:52:30 PM 1352 Views
About that bifurcation... - 14/04/2010 02:02:15 AM 1329 Views
I'm rather moderate - 14/04/2010 10:11:30 AM 1235 Views
I'm just a liberation theologist at heart - 15/04/2010 01:51:16 PM 2162 Views
So, if you don't mind... - 13/04/2010 05:51:06 AM 1311 Views
That's fine with me - 13/04/2010 06:31:41 AM 1282 Views
I'm sorry, but he's totally right. "The Circus" made me put down this series for 5 YEARS. - 09/04/2010 03:38:16 PM 1316 Views
I didn't find it quite that bad, but... - 11/04/2010 08:27:52 AM 1228 Views
LoC represented a sharp drop in quality!!? - 19/05/2010 03:27:21 PM 1337 Views
And ignores everything else... - 09/04/2010 05:10:00 PM 1378 Views
Inchoatus went offline a couple of years ago - 10/04/2010 11:42:26 AM 2303 Views
This guy is going to get what he deserves... - 09/04/2010 10:26:14 PM 1303 Views
I'm waiting with bated breath for his CoT review *NM* - 10/04/2010 01:00:59 PM 956 Views
Just wanted to point out that he is not reviewing the series. - 16/04/2010 04:04:49 PM 1303 Views
Lord of Chaos commentary - 16/04/2010 03:39:39 PM 1318 Views
He has reached - The Hump. - 16/04/2010 03:55:51 PM 1275 Views
Re: He has reached - The Hump. - 18/04/2010 08:08:59 AM 1512 Views
No no. It was Lord of Heaven! - 16/04/2010 05:51:11 PM 1232 Views
Yeah, I noticed that - 16/04/2010 11:16:26 PM 1141 Views
I would love the see him review Goodkind... - 16/04/2010 11:51:07 PM 1319 Views
Finally re-read that post - 20/04/2010 09:35:45 PM 1303 Views
The magic items are mostly irrelevant... - 21/04/2010 03:37:36 AM 1300 Views
A Crown of Swords - or is it deco-porn? - 23/04/2010 08:36:17 AM 1401 Views
Re: A Crown of Swords - or is it deco-porn? - 29/04/2010 06:02:28 PM 1318 Views
I disagree - 29/04/2010 09:34:49 PM 1164 Views
I agree. - 29/04/2010 09:45:29 PM 1354 Views
Took me a moment to realize with whom you were agreeing - 29/04/2010 10:19:05 PM 1246 Views
Well, I did mention the necklines get overdone... - 06/05/2010 06:17:46 PM 1614 Views
Well, there's now also the tea to comment about - 07/05/2010 11:29:03 AM 1353 Views
A bit of a stumble this week - 30/04/2010 01:53:31 PM 1388 Views
The Path of Daggers commentary - 07/05/2010 10:39:03 AM 1381 Views
You'd think a Brit would like the tea... *NM* - 11/05/2010 04:05:42 PM 822 Views
Maybe he's just a contrarian? - 11/05/2010 07:55:43 PM 1221 Views
Winter's Heart - 21/05/2010 12:46:14 PM 1387 Views
To be fair - 21/05/2010 01:56:49 PM 1493 Views
I think WH was my least favorite of the WoT novels I re-read - 21/05/2010 04:49:31 PM 1282 Views
Re: I think WH was my least favorite of the WoT novels I re-read - 25/05/2010 05:05:09 PM 1467 Views
WH was my least favorite novel in the series, and that is saying a lot. - 28/05/2010 03:15:13 PM 1373 Views
I completely agree with his KoD post. Here is my favorite quote: - 28/05/2010 03:08:31 PM 1597 Views
CoT, you mean (link to actual post included) - 28/05/2010 04:56:10 PM 1399 Views
Yep, I meant COT. *NM* - 28/05/2010 07:02:48 PM 817 Views
Knife of Dreams - 18/06/2010 09:07:27 AM 1295 Views
Re: Knife of Dreams - 19/06/2010 05:49:38 AM 1368 Views
Agree... - 19/06/2010 05:08:44 PM 1361 Views
Roberts reflects back on WoT 1-11, with answers to questions asked of him - 25/06/2010 12:51:29 PM 1371 Views
This guy should be burned at the stake - 25/06/2010 03:22:34 PM 8789 Views
Are you done making a fool out of yourself, Mark? - 26/06/2010 06:53:37 PM 1330 Views
Oh come on... - 26/06/2010 09:06:01 PM 1437 Views
Well, the burning at the stake was a bit much... - 26/06/2010 10:19:40 PM 1447 Views
Well, really! You brought the comment to his notice... - 26/06/2010 11:34:08 PM 1405 Views
And your point is...? - 27/06/2010 12:37:00 AM 1484 Views
Well... - 27/06/2010 05:38:12 AM 1425 Views
Indeed... I think it's rather clear that Larry's goal has been to cause trouble - 27/06/2010 10:57:36 AM 1563 Views
There is no "borderline" about it. - 28/03/2011 05:17:15 PM 1296 Views
Ridiculous - 27/06/2010 06:38:46 AM 1323 Views
I like his FAQ and his overall musings on its' popularity. - 29/06/2010 06:35:10 PM 1401 Views
One year later... - 27/03/2011 03:40:29 AM 1321 Views
Re: One year later... - 28/03/2011 05:03:32 PM 1232 Views
I see you subconsciously support critical takes. - 28/03/2011 11:41:48 PM 1541 Views
No I conciously support telling you and him that you are pathetic, arrogent, & jelous. *NM* - 30/03/2011 01:40:36 PM 885 Views
Jealous? - 30/03/2011 05:20:32 PM 1288 Views
I agree, I didn't even notice it was an old post, definitely did not deserve to be revived. *NM* - 30/03/2011 02:41:12 PM 800 Views
Seconded. - 30/03/2011 04:04:36 PM 1199 Views
Now I notice as well that this is a year old. You're very silly, Larry, very silly. *NM* - 30/03/2011 04:13:38 PM 839 Views
Yep! - 30/03/2011 05:16:38 PM 1227 Views
Jeez Larry, you're starting to sound like a GRRM detractor. - 31/03/2011 03:01:38 PM 1350 Views
Nah, no detractor - 01/04/2011 03:00:41 PM 1435 Views
Could a thread be locked? - 31/03/2011 07:48:26 PM 1218 Views
Re: One year later... - 01/04/2011 02:55:02 AM 1518 Views
Yep - 01/04/2011 02:57:52 PM 1371 Views

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